Thread: Coticule kosher

I already have a coticule bout which i have to create slurry on with slurry stone so i should imagine this is classed as hard? I have just orderd a 125 by 40 coticule kosher highest quality from ardeenes Rob I no this is softer and will create a slurry quiker but what i would like to no is if any one uses one of these and how does it compare to the one i have got basicly what is the differance in the results any recomendation on how best used and when ie as finisher or not.

I'm not sure that I agree with your assessments. First, any coticule will create a slurry during honing but rubbing it with another stone will create the slurry faster. The fact that you are using a slurry stone to create a slurry does not necessarily mean that your coticule is hard. Second, not all kosher coticules are soft. One of my koshers is extremely hard. It is my understanding that the kosher grade relates to lack of discoloration in the stone and that it has nothing to do with the hardness of the stone.

If you were told something else then please elaborate on it, as I think I've been wrong once before.

What was your reasoning for getting the second coticule? Trust me I'm not criticizing you for it. I own more than two coticules myself! Were you unhappy with the hardness of the first one?

To be onest i was guessing at hardness that is why i posted the thread and as you have coticules you have the experiance of using them. I do realize i can raize a slurry faster with my slurry stone. It's just that while i'm actualy honong my razor up and down my hone i'd of thought this action would slowly create a slight white slurry but my hone does'nt that is why i perzumed it is a harder coticule unlike with a coti that does create its own slurry by honing razor up and down hone i would perzume this would be clased as a softer coticule. How do i tell a hard coticule to a softer one? My reason for buying a higher qulity kosher was because rob is doing some fantastic offers to members and to be onest i perzumed by higher quality it would perform better and was worth a try even though my recent is good .

I think that the difference is going to be the color of the coticule and the shape. I don't think you'll see so much of a difference in your honing. YMMV.

I am also under the impression that the kosher grading has to do with purity of color. The one kosher coticule I got from Ardennes is a finisher and harder then my other three. Good for that though.

Rob did say the kosher would raize a s;urry a lot quiker does yours raize a slurry.

Originally Posted by gary haywood

To be onest i was guessing at hardness that is why i posted the thread and as you have coticules you have the experiance of using them. I do realize i can raize a slurry faster with my slurry stone. It's just that while i'm actualy honong my razor up and down my hone i'd of thought this action would slowly create a slight white slurry but my hone does'nt that is why i perzumed it is a harder coticule unlike with a coti that does create its own slurry by honing razor up and down hone i would perzume this would be clased as a softer coticule. How do i tell a hard coticule to a softer one? My reason for buying a higher qulity kosher was because rob is doing some fantastic offers to members and to be onest i perzumed by higher quality it would perform better and was worth a try even though my recent is good .

I don't argue your logic at all. Hardness is relative. I would guess that you are getting a slurry when you are honing but it is not getting thick enough to be visible. It is possible that your current stone is extremely hard but you have nothing to compare it with. When you get Rob's kosher, you will have something to compare it with and since you will then have two coticules, you can always make a slurry by rubbing the two of them together.

Originally Posted by gary haywood

Rob did say the kosher would raize a s;urry a lot quiker does yours raize a slurry.

Sure, any stone will raise a slurry if rubbed with another stone or a diamond plate. I like to use my kosher stone with water only as a finisher. Yours may be the same, harder or softer. Unlike synthetic stones such as Shaptons, or Nortons all natural stones vary a bit. Don't let that put you off though as the coticule is a very versatile stone.

I also believe that the Kosher coticule is a grade with no discolorations throughout the hone. Kosher does not refer to hardness or softness.

As for the differences between coticules, well I believe that the differences are not great. The garnets that do the cutting are I believe all of the same general shape and size. So the variables are how many garnets are rolling around and are they rolling around on a hard or soft surface.

If you make a nice thick slurry, I think you will get a quick cutting action with any coticule. I also think that a harder surface is a better base to work off for fast cutting .

For the final polishing, I suspect that a soft surface with no slurry may do the better job. But I'm not sure of this. I suspect that for polishing, the flatter the surface, the better the polish. A soft surface will loose the high lying garnets, thereby leveling the stone. The harder stone is less likely to level.

I have a hard coticule and a soft rubbing stone. I don't really like to shave off my coticule edge, it just isn't quite good enough. But I know many do shave off their coticules and I suspect that this is because their stones have a softer surface and give a better polish. I don't think it's because they can hone any better although this may be the reason.

So, I think what I am saying is I hope your Kosher coticule is a softer stone and then it will I believe put a really fine polish on your razors and this has to be a good thing.

Over 50 years ago there weren't that many good synthetic hones available. For honing razors and scalpels and other presicion cutlery, people formed the edge on softer and quick Coticules, before going to a harder and finer Coticule for the final polish. They had found through decades of trial, which Coticule veins were best for carpenter use, which for razors, which for leather workers, etc.
That's basically what I read in a small booklet, written in French about 40 years ago, about the use of Coticules. I'm not sure how scientifically sound the grading of the Coticule veins was in the old days, and I'm even more puzzled about the relevance of it all, today.
I never found much variance in the polishing abilities of several Coticules, when used with water.
I think it's more important that you told Rob the purpose for your hone, than what label (Kosher, slelect or standard) it is carrying.

Bart.