Thread: Significant disadvantage of X-pattern or i do it incorrectly ?

The main thing about the X pattern is that you need a nice even stroke, making sure the blade stays flat on the stone and very little pressure. When you see more wear at either the spine or in the edge, uneven pressure during the stroke is the likely culprit. Frowns and flattened tips or heels usually do not come with an even stroke and usually show up when there has been way more honing done to a razor than is necessary. It would take a significant amount of use and honing to wear a frown into a blade with normal honing, no matter how wide the stone is. Like everything in this sport, it is all about feel and practice.

Have fun,

Lynn

I too notice that if I don't make a conscious effort to keep the blade flat during an x-stroke I have a habit of tilting the blade. This is usually due to me trying to lighten the pressure too much and the weight of the scales tilts the blade.

I also noticed in reading some replies, not really this in this post, that people will use the term x-stroke when referring to what I would call a "rolling x-stroke". My understanding is that for the most part you should always use an x-stroke, even on a 3 inch hone, because that provides a better cutting angle. And that a rolling x-stroke is something you use when you have a blade that doesn't contact the hone evenly across the length.

I can see how if a blade has a toe that doesn't touch the hone when the blade is laid flat the toe will still make contact at the end of the normal x-stroke because that is the only part now on the hone, but the same cannot be said be a heel that doesn't touch the hone because you would have to tilt the blade, hence the rolling part, in order for it to make contact.

Please correct me if I'm wrong in this understanding.

That is my understanding of the rolling X as well. Smiling blades and/or warped spines are where it is required. I have read some feel that an X stroke isn't necessary on a 3" hone but I always use it and I think creates the best edge.

Originally Posted by syslight

I just looked at his website and i think it is available now!

Got one on the way.

When i bought my first razor (DOVO 5/8, not used before) it had uneven bevel and the spine worn out in the middle but looked normal at other spots. I was astonished. Is it possible that it was sold as defective product from the DOVO factory (cheaper) ?
I also have other razor but it has much better bevel. However both razors achieve the same level sharpness when honed on 4k (i'm still waiting for my ordered 8k). I shaved with them but there is some uncomfortable pulling at ATG (i realize they are not sharp enough)

If the Dovo was supposed to be new and unused I would have contacted the vendor and asked for a replacement of a refund. If it is defective in workmanship Dovo/Merkur might replace it for you. Anne Rothstein was the customer rep I dealt with a time or two and she was very nice and very helpful. OTOH, if you've got honing it figured out in spite of the spine it might be alright as is.

Your complicating the issue of different strokes... The only thing that has to happen to attain a sharp edge is that the entire edge has to contact the stone evenly down the hone.... Period end of story!!! How you have to manipulate that stroke to accomplish this, is where you get Rolling X stroke, X strokes, Heel forward stokes,, etc; etc:
If you go back one step and set the bevel you might add a few more fancy strokes in there too... But the bottom line, so to speak, is that the edge has to slide across the stone equally to attain an edge, it really doesn't matter what the stone is, or the razor geometry, if you cannot slide that edge across the stone evenly, you will not get a good edge or bevel....

Pressure is another thing that gets confusing when we talk about it on here. The term Zero pressure is tossed about a little to "lightly"... You need to use exactly enough pressure/control to keep the edge on the hone evenly, no more, no less....

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Your complicating the issue of different strokes... The only thing that has to happen to attain a sharp edge is that the entire edge has to contact the stone evenly down the hone....

Well put Glen. I don't know if that was directed at me or the thread in general but I feel the need to elaborate on my earlier post. I was mentioning the fact that I see people say "x-stroke" when they mean "rolling x-stroke" because I think it leads to confusion. I can see someone who doesn't know any better doing lap after lap of x-strokes like he was told wondering why he can't get a sharp edge along the entire length when in fact it was a "rolling x-stroke" that he should have been doing. Just an observation is all. Though now that I look I see that this is the basic honing section and this semantics conversation may be a bit out of place.

Anyway, regarding the initial post, I don't see a disadvantage to doing an x-stroke. Though it may be true that part of the blade remains in contact with the hone for a longer time I feel that it is splitting hairs to worry about it. It's not as if one day you are going to pull out your razor and notice a huge frown. Maybe if you were in the habit of honing your blades every week you may see a problem but if that's the case you've got other issues to work out as it is.

Not at you at all, JC sorry for that implication, and I am in agreement that an X stroke doesn't create an un-even spine or bevel IF IT IS DONE EVENLY