Thread: Where to spend my time...

I started honing a few months ago. While I've made progress, I'm certain I have much room for improvement. I need some advice on where to spend more time or what to change to improve my current results.

I have a DMT 1200, a Naniwa 3K/8K combo and a Naniwa 12K. My main target razor is a 6/8, 3/4 hollow TI finished Le Grelot. I can consistently get seriously vibrating hanging hairs straight off the 12K, but they won't do more than that. I can put 60 laps on linen and 60 laps on horsehide and it will catch and cut but still won't pop. The shave is okay (a little pulling but not horrible). Razors I've gotten from honmeisters will pop hairs (so I know my hair samples are capable of this) and will deliver better shaves. So, I know I can do better, but I'm just not sure where I should be spending my time.

I've taken my razor all the way back to bevel setting. Off the DMT, I can set a bevel that will shave arm hair fairly easily, so I don't think it's a bevel problem. Then I take about 35 laps or so on the 3K, followed by 25 laps or so on the 8K and finishing with roughly 20 laps on the 12K. It seems like that's what people are doing based on what I've read and watched. Maybe a little more in some cases, but this may be what you achieve as a true honemiester guru, which definitely does not describe me. Many have described feeling when the hone has given its all, and then move on. While I think I'm starting to notice nuances in how the hone stroke feels, I haven't reached a point where I can read what these changes mean, and I definitely can’t tell when a particular hone has given its all.

Pressure wise, I'm really only steadying the razor on the hone through my stroke. I'm not applying any pressure at all. I wonder sometimes if I should be applying a teensy bit of pressure or if I should continue to let the hone do all of the work. And, if I should be letting the hone do all of the work, that brings me back around to the question in the title. Given my current results, where should I be spending my time? Is this likely the result of deficient time on the 3K? The 8K? The 12K? I also wonder if it's reasonable to expect to someday be able to pop hanging hairs right off a hone (i.e. without stropping) or if I should always expect to have to strop it a bit to be able to pop hairs?

Any guidance is appreciated.

Thanks.

Personally, I do alot more laps per stone than you. I do anywhere from 60 to 90 laps. Also, I do use a little pressure, not much but just enough to make sure the edge is flat and making good contact with the stone.

IME different razors and different stones may require a different approach. So it's a TI Le Grolet and they can be tough IME. In general I use a bit more pressure on a heavier grind when setting a bevel and lighten up as I progress. Full hollows will flex on you but heavier grinds are stiffer and can take a bit more pressure. A bit, not like lapping a waterstone.

I do what Lynn recommends with 40 circles each side and then 20 x strokes. Do a TNT and see if it grabs well from heel to point. Keep at it until it does and then do x strokes until it shaves arm/leg hair (you'll run out of arm hair ) , Once at that point I would do a pyramid as laid out in the SRP Wiki with the 3 and 8 that you have.

I would use the TPT and hair popping (without touching skin) until I felt the razor was "there" and then I would strop and test shave. Off the 8k, not up to the 12k until I felt like it was good with the 8k. If it needed more on the 8 I would do that and test again until it was good at 8k. Then move to 12k to polish and refine further. Maybe 10 passes , lightly and politely , and try it. Another 10 if necessary and so on. Just what I would do, not necessarily the "right" way to do.

I like Jimmy's advice. The extra sharpness you seek is hidden in using no pressure.

You can add a touch of pressure at almost every step you discuss, with the exception of the very, very, very, last step.

If you need just a little extra to "get there" have you considered pastes? Even Lynn uses diamond spray to get some killer edges.

On the other hand it is hard to tell from your description how close your edge is coming off the hones...

I like what Jimmy said and Ryan. I was going to bring up pastes. Pressure, the blade dictates it for me, a little more when setting the bevel, and less as I progress, espcially when I get to the finishers..pretty much 0 pressure then...just the weight of the blade. At this point, your just guiding it....

Full hollows, a lot less than a wedge, just like Jimmy said...I know everyone wants that velvet squegee edge from a stone, but it takes practice...for now, There's no harm in taking your blades to some pastes or sprays...

I really like SRD'd hard wool felt with .50 diamond. 10 - 20 lapps, depending on the blade will really take you to the next level...I also have several paddles I use with Diamond pastes...1.0, .50, and .25....Many times, after the .25 diamond paste, I back up to Chromium Oxide. I've always felt this takes away some of the sting associated with the .25 diamond paste...There is no shame in using pastes......LOL....

My first observation is that a bevel generated by a DMT is very rough and requires much more time on the 3K-4K than a bevel off a regular waterstone.

Second, ...pressure... The first half of my laps are done with a bit of pressure and the last half with only the weight of the blade.

Third....number of laps.... I generally perform 50 laps minimum on the 4K and 30-50 laps on the 8K.

From there I use various tests, HHT, TPT and perform small pyramids til the edge passes my tests.

Then I strop and have a test shave.

If more is needed then I use small pyramids ( 6K & 8K).

I seldom go back to the 1K! ( why go back to square one?) and try not to go back to a 4K, I much prefer a 6K.

Reasonable expectations..... I almost always require at least 2 honing sessions/test shaves to dial in the edge to suit me. Three sessions is common and 4 or 5 on razors with really hard/tough steel.

For your case I think you have not yet smoothed out the DMT bevel yet and need to perform small pyramids til the edge passes your tests.


Just my $.02,