Thread: What exactly is overhoning?

IMHO, overhoning is defined as an edge that has been honed so thin that when it encounters a whisker, it bends away from the whisker or into the skin. The shave is most unpleasant, it skips over some whiskers & cuts a few very poorly.
The next stage of overhoning is when the edge develops microchipping, it actually has small chunks falling off the edge.
The final stage is when small sections of the edge start curling over and/or falling off.

It seems that underhoning was a major problem for a number of years but now with the advent of the very aggressive hones like the DMT and the switch from focusing on forming the bevel with the 4000 grit and now focusing on the 1000 grit as a bevel setter we will be seeing a weak, thin edge being created more often from over use of the coarse hones. I use the coarse hones( 1000 grit) to remove weak steel and remove microchips. I use the 4000 grit to "set the bevel".

To the OP question of what it takes to overhone the answer is it really depends on the steel and how fine you had the edge before you began trying. 2 years ago I deliberately overhoned on a Coticule, a escher and CH12K.
For me it took between ~ 400( 600?) laps.

Just my $.02,

600 on the C12k ? I thought that was normal procedure

Personally I think this theory on over honing is causing a lot of new guys here to not get the best of their edges. When I first started to hone about a year and a half ago I did a lot less laps then I do now, especially on the 4/8k norton stone, because of a fear of over honing. Now I use tests to see if I need to keep working on the 4k or the 8k, shaving arm test for example, and I keep honing if I need to. I hardly ever count strokes anymore, I may count "sets" instead every once and a while.

Now I do think that when you're new at honing you can mess up an edge easily with less strokes than a honemeister would with 300 strokes, but that's all in the stroke/wrist.
Same thing goes with finishing razors. For me I like to use my Escher the most for finishing razors, its a dark blue and I use slurry on it, like the label tells me to. Now I do a lot of strokes on that thing until the edge is where I like it. I may do 5 sets of 30 strokes, whatever it takes...
When I shave test the edge is great and I have had no issues with crumbling due to finishing on an escher with slurry and fifty to a hundred strokes.

I don't think I've ever experienced over-honing.

I worry about it off my DMT 1200 (which I use for bevel-setting). So I generally dull the razor after using that hone once the bevel is done.

With a coticule, it's pretty easy to regain a shaving edge from that point. With cotis, Japanese naturals, and Charnleys, I've never been able to over-hone.

Originally Posted by yohannrjm

I don't think I've ever experienced over-honing.

I worry about it off my DMT 1200 (which I use for bevel-setting). So I generally dull the razor after using that hone once the bevel is done.

With a coticule, it's pretty easy to regain a shaving edge from that point. With cotis, Japanese naturals, and Charnleys, I've never been able to over-hone.

No need to dull the razor after the DMT 1200. IME, The coti will clean up any burr or microchipping off the DMT without overhoning.

I just don't "get" dulling a razor

Originally Posted by onimaru55

No need to dull the razor after the DMT 1200. IME, The coti will clean up any burr or microchipping off the DMT without overhoning.

I agree with this. I also was surprised at the "dulling step".

IIRC, the concept of dulling the razor on a glass came up with the intro of the dulicot method. So that new guys trying it would be starting from square one, as it were, to insure a 'controlled' experiment. It seems to have taken on a life of its own since then. I don't practice that either. I have enough trouble without dulling them on purpose.

I've got more than a few razors here that are "dull" & need honing if anyone wants to practice honing... but I want 'em back

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Almost to the week You can go find the same response form me most every 6 months going back a few years

....snip....


Please do not start the whole over honing thing again....

[B]Anyone who even thinks they are over honing just take a razor and try and do it...

....snip....

Sorry for the rant but IME the whole over honing thing is just a cover for poor bevel sets in the first place...

Rant away but you hit the pin on
the pivot point just right.

Anyone that is worried about it should just try.

It will take more than a dozen tries but
if you first hone a minimum and the blade is
not sharp.... shave test

Hone and strop it again.... shave test.
and
Hone and strop it again.... shave test.
and again and again and again... test test test.

As you hone more and more the blade gets sharper and sharper
up to the point that it gets no sharper. Anything beyond
shave ready sharp gets no sharper is over honing. In some
cases it will get sharper and sharper then get duller which
is classic over honing.

For those that elect to try it, the result will differ based on
their razor, the hone, the method and the man driving the
hone and razor.

So try it.

Over honing is when my wife complains that I have been spending way too much time paying with razors and hones and not enought time with her. The solution is usually put the hones away and go to bed.