Thread: suggestions for mellow on a bucget?

I'm new and I realize that there is a lot I do not know. I am an experienced knife sharpener and have modified/polished quite a few blades.

Here is my latest opportunity to learn.

I honed a vintage extra hollow razor (and repaired it by honing out the rust spots and nicks along the edge). I use DMT plates to accomplish this and finished with DMT 8000/3 micron plate before taking it to a balsa strop loaded with chromium oxide, followed with a balsa strop of iron oxide (reportedly 0.1 micron) and then about 100 laps on a leather strop. If it helps, I did 50 laps on each balsa strop.

I then tested the blade with HHT (I wanted some assurance that the blade was decent before I took it to my neck). I tested 4 portions of the blade passing in both directions. It is a solid HHT3...some might call it a HHT4.

But it shaves harshly. It gives a nice close shave, but it irritates my skin more than the others I have tried (honed by Pros...perhaps finishing on much more extravagant media than I have).

If anyone can shove me in a good direction, I would appreciate it!

The scratch patterns produced by the diamond plates can be a bit harsh.
One of the greatest inventions is the Norton 4/8k combo stone and the pyramids that are in the honing section of the Wiki.
That stone, combined with your pasted balsa should give you good results. It won't break the budget, either. The King brand stones are cheaper but it's a sub $20 difference for the combo stone if I recall correctly so get the Nortons.
You'll need a way to lap it but if you have diamond plates or wet/dry sandpaper and a flat granite tile you will be gtg.

I was hoping that there would be another way. But the Norton was among my list of wants. I was also contemplating a nice-ish (I am on a budget) finish stone in hopes that I could hone with diamonds, then remove the evidence with a good finish.

Like I said, I am new to this, but in polishing metals (1095, 1080, ZDP-189, and numerous other "super steels") I have used diamonds to produce mirror finished...in each step I remove the scratches from the last step....using this logic, it would seem that a decent natural stone would be able to remove the scratches from the diamond hones.

I am not arguing, rather, I am asking if this logic bears any consideration...particularly from anyone that has tried it. I would rather stand on the shoulders of giants than re-invent the wheel....which basically brings me back to buying the Norton LOL.

Thanks to you and anyone else that offers advice to a budding enthusiast.

I see what you are saying, and at this point I would resort to viewing your edge under bright light with a 10X loupe. I doubt that any problem in the edge that is unnoticeable under 10X would cause a harsh shave. If you see nothing wrong with the edge under that kind of magnification, then I would consider dropping the pastes out of the equation. You did seem to have used quite a few laps and that amount of stropping on paste may have rounded your newly-formed bevel or compromised the edge's sharpness. I don't use pastes because: 1) I do quite well with stone and leather and 2) it is very difficult for me to evaluate what in fact they are doing. The point here would be that your edge might not be as sharp as you think, and the result could be application of more pressure than necessary.

I've got those diamond plates and I also found the finish harsh off of the 8000. I've read that in reality it is more a 4k than an 8k but I don't know if that is so. I used to use the DMT 1200 for bevel setting but not anymore. I have tried a lot of hones over the past few years and settled on the chosera 1k if a bevel set is needed, and the norton 4&8 for the sharpening and finishing work.

IME shaving off of the norton 8k following stropping on clean horsehide gives HHT and a fine shave. This ought to be done before any higher grit finishing to make sure you've squeezed all the juice out of the 8k before going up the grit ladder.

Gilding the lilly with a finisher is optional. I do, because I had HAD and I've got 'em. IMHO going as far as the 8k and following with chrom-ox and then clean stropping will be all a guy would need to get great shaves for the rest of his life.

The finishing stones are icing on the cake and not really necessary unless that is a part of the hobby you want to pursue. Some of them are great but like I said above, not necessary for a DFS.

You could get a coticule and start with a mild slurry then dilute to plain water.
If you go this route get the biggest one you can afford, my 1x5 does the job but at a real slow pace.
Eric.

A decent cheap way that would probably tame the edge is to make a cheap paddle strop. Old belt and scrap wood will do and get the combination blocks of red and black paste. They tend to give really smooth edges.

Sharpening knives and razors is not the same. Visually your bevels might look perfect but the edge can still be harsh to the skin. On a razor you really have to polish the edge as the cheek can feel it, while the tomato does not care if the edge is finished to 1k, 5k, 16k. Diamond plates leave deeper scratches than a water stone would, so in order tor refine an edge you will need to work more on the pastes but IMO the better results will come with using different stone(s). As mentioned above 4/8k Norton is perfect stone to learn on, then you can expand to a higher grit synthetic or a nice natural.

More time on the chromium oxide until you have entirely removed the deep 3 micron diamond scratches. Then leather, and if it's still harsh, just a tad more pressure on the leather to make sure you've worked off anything hanging loose on the edge from the chromium oxide.

You can use a bit of pressure on the balsa with the chromium oxide, it will not be harsh. Whatever you do, you absolutely need to get rid of the tooth left by the DMT, but you don't need to spend more money on this issue unless you want to.

Under raking light or with a loupe, you should be able to verify visually that you have an excellent polish all of the way to the edge (which is what counts, anyway, right? The edge) with chromium oxide and no sign of any scratches. If the chromium oxide has blackened or loaded, don't be afraid to loosen it a bit with a light abrasion from a plastic bristle brush or add more.

Hone as normal and then finish on a strop with Chromium oxide or Cerium oxide. That will smooth out the teeth on the razor enough to cut smooth.
HHT will pass if the edge has a lot of misaligned teeth causing the grip and pop on the hair...
...you can check a million threads on the HHT and see the arguments against it, if you want to use it that's fine too.

I haven't used Iron Oxide so I don't know how it changes the edge to comment on that.

you can also pick up green lapping film on Amazon and use that after the 8000DMT for a finisher on a piece of tile or glass. That gives a 16K level edge and shaves like the mystical Velvet Squeegy you hear about in dreams of shaving, then finish on your iron oxide. The film is very cheap.

Hope this helps.