Thread: Japanese Swords

Originally Posted by basil

As for the generalizations that the Chinese stuff is crap, don't we do that with razors usually?

Please, for the love of god let's not reopen the Double Arrow/Gold Dollar debate... too many feelings have been hurt over that one already

Originally Posted by Ryan82

Please, for the love of god let's not reopen the Double Arrow/Gold Dollar debate... too many feelings have been hurt over that one already

Haha I know I won't start.

But just wanted to show that just as we are passionate about good razors and not the crappy ones, that the sword enthusiast must feel the same way about some Chinese copies.

Not saying all are bad but there are some that are bad for both razors and swords.

Originally Posted by Ryan82

And I never said you used the term bad specifically, but you did equate quality, authenticity and country of origin with the generalization that they are somehow related. So then, how is a product made in the U.S. any more "authentic" than a product made in China or anywhere else for that matter? Do a Google search, "authentic" tamahagane swords seem to come mostly out of the US.


Sorry bud, but someone has to play devil's advocate here. I do agree that a $10 knockoff is useless for pretty much anything, but the fact is that this thread has drifted far from the OP's question. He stated that he wasn't going to "use the sword for anything", so whatever he ends up buying will be little more than a showpiece for the livingroom anyway. Unless he's rich or planning on seriously getting into Iaido or Iaijutsu there is little point in him contemplating buying a real Japanese tamahagane masterpiece for upward of $6000 anyway....

A product made in the USA is more authentic when the smith takes the trouble to make it authentic & that includes the geometry as well as finish. It would take way to long to explain that here. For the sake of brevity it's like plastic sushi compared to real sushi. They can look the same at a distance but up close which one do you wanna eat ?
As Mike already said there are US smiths that have respect from Japan. I'm unaware of any Chinese forges that are highly regarded by Japan as authentic makers. Unless you are a collector or user that may mean very little to you but the OP's question was
"Does anyone here have any Japanese swords? Or maybe be able to recommend me a good one"
I may have taken that too literally.

I have owned 3 Japanese swords dating from 1600's -1800's & have also owned 8 or 9 Chinese made swords. I also have a little less than 40 years experience in martial arts, 26 of those in a sword based school. My opinion is based on what is really, really, really obvious to my eyes & my hands.


@ Basil if you are going to attempt the occasional cut with no training there is a good chance you will bend the blade so maybe cheaper is good... but training is better

Originally Posted by onimaru55

...My opinion is based on what is really, really, really obvious to my eyes & my hands.

@ Basil if you are going to attempt the occasional cut with no training there is a good chance you will bend the blade so maybe cheaper is good... but training is better

I could easily say something similar but you beat me to it. Basil, training will give you much much more than just owning a sword.

This reminds me of arguments many years ago about who made the best blades. It always started with "So, if a fellow armed with a Masamune (fill in the blank) met a guy with a great two handed sword (another blank), who would win?" Or somesuch nonsense.

The answer is along the lines of which of these gents has the best technique. I'd worry more about a master swordsman armed with a rusty lawnmower blade than a beginner with the finest sword in the world. It's not the sword that cuts, but the person.

I'm not so sure if my example would hold true for razors in the same way.

Mike, I'm not going to go in depth here, but I do appreciate your answer--in fact, I think it's the only really acceptable answer to the question I asked.
I think what I was addressing, implying, or whatever (Sorry, my vocabulary and typing are going to be suffering from the Sake) was that all too many people see this word, "Japanese," and buy into a myth. What I think people should look at is, rather than the myth of the might samurai or whatever, the tradition of human skill and mastery, the relationship with history and the people who have dedicated themselves to the perfection of their craft, that should be valued and respected.

Just saying "I got this wicked awesome Japanese sword for, like, twenty bucks!" is, to me, an insult to people who have made the craft meaningful.

I didn't actually mean to imply that only Japanese people could make Katana/Nihonto, but that simply making a slightly curved, sharp piece of metal does not really equate with the work of a man who has spent decades on his craft--which is kind of what I see with a lot of the non-Japanese produced swords...someone just thought it would be cool.

As for Tamahagane, again--this isn't about the myth, the steel is just pure steel. It's about the tradition, and respect for the tradition surpasses any national lines. That's what the swordmakers bowed to--not your sword, but your attitude toward their traditions.

anwya. I hope that makes sense.

Originally Posted by JimR

...anwya. I hope that makes sense.

Despite your sake accent... It does and you do.

Kanpai Jim san

There are a lot of replica swords out there that you really have to be careful as they are not built very well, and
you can get really injured trying to use them.

YouTube - The Perils of Cheap Fantasy Swords