Thread: William Greaves and Sons Chinese Razor

So....back to G.Crooks. What is relationship to C.Crookes, Johnathan Crooks, Brooks and Crookes???

Originally Posted by sharptonn

So....back to G.Crooks. What is relationship to C.Crookes, Johnathan Crooks, Brooks and Crookes???

Looks to be at best distantly related.

George Crookes' son was Henry.

Jonathan Crookes was the son of Marmaduke who was the son of another Jonathan (who originated the mark in the late 1700's). The grandson Jonathan got his start working for Joseph Rodgers where he helped build the famous Year Knife.

The Crookes of Brookes & Crookes was Thomas and he had no experience in the cutlery biz when he partnered with John Brookes.

The Crookes brothers Henry and John Crookes, sons of John Crookes and unrelated to the Henry Crookes, son of George Crookes. They formed a partnership with John Slater and became Crookes & Slater.

Samuel Crookes was a somewhat mysterious razor manufacturer born in 1790 who died in 1840.

William Crookes made spring knives and worked for George Butler.

I can't find a C. Crookes.

Well, I shall look at it again and take a picture. Perhaps mine is a 'G' and has been misread. It says improved razor on it.

Voidmonster here is a pic of the blade etch

Originally Posted by Slamthunderide

Voidmonster here is a pic of the blade etch

Perfect! I can find one listing for them at that address in Doggett's New York City Directory for 1848-1849. Groesbeeck & Co, Importers, 30 Maiden Lane. They were at a different address in 1846, and a different one still in 1850. So you've got a REALLY narrow range of dates for that one!

Originally Posted by Voidmonster

As was surmised, the first three razors from the top are pure gibberish. The bottom two, although inaccurately scripted by a non-chinese writer, do have a measure of legitimacy. Let's examine:


From left to right, we see (in romanized Mandarain): dú hǎo diÃo

However, these characters are laid down on their left side; they would more appropriately be displayed as such (left to right becomes top to bottom):



It can be considered a stretch to loosely narrow it down to these characters as some of the strokes and even whole radicals are entirely out of place. However, the characters for which they were aiming is fairly obvious. And then the translation:

獨(一無二的) - dú'yīwú'èrde (pr. DOO-EEE-WOO-'UHR-DUH): unique, unparalleled, distinctive
好 - hǎo (pr. 'HOW): good
調 - diÃo or tiáo (pr. DEE-'YOW or TEE-'YOW): (a number of possibilities here)--tone / intonation / tune / key (as in music); to suit well or fit in perfectly; melody; and a few less likely possibilities.

One could combine them into familiar razor jargon along the lines of "Uniquely/Distinctly/Exceptionally Toned/Tuned/Suited/Suitable" (and several other translations).

Here's one Max sold (Joseph Elliot):







I hope this offers a degree of clarity.

Cheers,
Will


src: I'm not Chinese. I double-majored in Asian Studies and Chinese Language & Literature. I also worked for several years as a Chinese linguist. I continue to use my Chinese experience and education in a (secondary) professional capacity.

I think you're spot on, Will.
I showed a friend of mine, a native Mandarin speaker, the photo of the yellow-scaled razor this weekend. They translated the middle character as good, or nice.

My Greaves Chinese Razor

Originally Posted by Voidmonster

I've got a G. Crookes and I've seen Joseph Rodgers, a Wostenholm or two, and I think also a Joseph Elliot. I'd be pretty surprised if there were any of the 'name brands' who didn't have fake Chinese razors.

Why would anyone FAKE a chinese razor, or any other edge too? A Japanese, swedish, or german fake I can understand. But the middle kingdom hasn't exactly been known for the quality of their steel.

No no! The razors are not fake. Good Sheffield blades. The 'Chinese' script is fake upon some of them. It was just a marketing ploy!