Thread: carbon or stainless, any thoughts?

The steel makes no difference, it's the razor that's important. I've had and still have absolutely fantastic razors in stainless and non-stainless steels.
I am pretty sure every person who has been around for a while and tried some of the top razors will tell you the exact same thing. Also I have not yet found a current production razor to shave as good as my best vintage ones. But I've only tried about 150 razors so far with less than 10% of them being current production ones.

Of course, it all depends on what's important to you. A bit over $100 will get you the tortoise special which I personally consider an upgrade to what you have. To access stainless steel razors you're looking at at least $150 and at this price point you can actually get great vintage one. But you have to know what to get and be willing to overlook insignificant defects, like warped scales or few of speckles of tarnish.

Anyways, good luck in your search.

Originally Posted by li885

On a different note, the Hippie in me says a vintage razor is the "greener" way to go. Many of those are going to be carbon steel plus have the tie to the past many of us seek.

Seconded. Definitely greener. They're already made and some only require sharpening. I would say almost all are non-stainless.

Thought this might be a good place to ask this. Anyone heard of 440c high carbon martensitic stainless steel? If so any good as razor?

Originally Posted by li885

Pardon me, I know it has been covered already but the internet is for bad opinions and porn.
Every Carbon steel knife ever owned has far out performed it stainless brothers. The only advantage that I can endorse for stainless is the corrosion resistance.
On a different note, the Hippie in me says a vintage razor is the "greener" way to go. Many of those are going to be carbon steel plus have the tie to the past many of us seek.

I second both observations, the purpose of the internet and the green value of used razors. Plus I get a kick thinking about the history of the Bokers I routinely use. Who knows where they have been and what they have seen. By the time I pass them onto my grandson they will all be over a hundred years old, and he will at least know some of their history.

Originally Posted by JimmyHAD

I'm no expert but ......... I do know that stainless is generally more abrasion resistant. That is one of the characteristics that gives it the reputation for being more difficult to hone to a shaving edge. I am pretty sure hardness is determined by the specific alloys in the steel be it carbon or stainless and by the heat treating and tempering. I could be wrong. I was wrong once before.

I challenge you to find a single stainless alloy that will reach the hardness of quality high carbon steel. You can come close with some of the martensitic stainless steels, but that's about it. Stainless razors (and knives for that matter) are harder to hone because of the way they behave when passed over an abrasive surface. Stainless steels tend to gall, leading to an uneven edge that is difficult to smooth. Carbon steels do not. It is that simple (or complicated if you want to look at it that way).

Originally Posted by paco

Thought this might be a good place to ask this. Anyone heard of 440c high carbon martensitic stainless steel? If so any good as razor?

440 stainless is often used for edged tools. There are also some modified forms that are slightly better Not as hard as carbon steel, but very close.

It's not a hardness contest. Extremely hard blades can be brittle on the hones and even on the beard.

I expect a decent razor to give me about 20-30 shaves without any need for honing. My best shavers, coincidentally (??), also offer me the best longevity, holding way over 30 shaves. There's a stainless Friodur among them, but also a Celebrated Sheffield wedge and a "Manganese steel" full hollow Bartmann.

If there was any consistent observation to be made in favor of a certain alloy, most seasoned shavers would probably know it and favor it.

Like Jimmy, I have long distrusted stainless. I believed the "stainless is a trade-off between corrosion resistance and general durability"- prejudice. It seemed, somehow, only fair. I have learned ever since, that the reality is more complex than that, and that there is no single objection to be made against buying a stainless steel razor.

Based upon the theory that stainless is more wear resistant at comparable hardness, and that both types of steel can be hardened into the optimum range for razors, I would suspect that stainless edges have slightly better durability. Real life experience, has not been able to confirm this nor falsify it. I suspect that there are too much other variables at play to worry much about alloy.

Bart.

Not singling anyone out here, but this thread has SOOOOOOO much MISinformation from so many parties that I can't even begin to comment. Where the info in some of these comments comes from I have NO idea.

My suggestion to anyone even remotely thinking of following any of the given advice or opinions in this thread is to take it all with a grain of salt and begin doing some serious research for yourself.

Originally Posted by Philadelph

Not singling anyone out here, but this thread has SOOOOOOO much MISinformation from so many parties that I can't even begin to comment. Where the info in some of these comments comes from I have NO idea.

My suggestion to anyone even remotely thinking of following any of the given advice or opinions in this thread is to take it all with a grain of salt and begin doing some serious research for yourself.

If it was anything in my post, I would be glad to stand corrected. I'm always eager to learn more about this subject, but it seems impossible to find good objective information about it. On most SRP threads about alloy properties for edge development and retention, the guys with the experience (read "razorsmiths") remain notoriously silent or at least reluctant to share their opinion and knowledge.

So please, Alex, I would be most grateful if you did comment.

Kind regards,
Bart.

The main reason edges loose their sharpness is oxidation rusts the edge away whilst the blade lies idle. The reason we strop everyday is to remove the oxidation off the razors edge. The blackness on the strop is mostly rust. Carbon steel will start to rust immediately in most atmospheres unless the blade is oiled.

Stainless blades do not rust any were nearly as much as traditional carbon steel blades. This is a distinct advantage and its interesting that DOVO has as its flagship production razor a stainless blade. The advantage is that the sharp edge should require less maintenance and therefore last longer.

I think that a good stainless blade is just as smooth and as sharp as a good carbon steel blade although I have noticed that the really finely ground razors are in carbon steel. I do not think that I have seen a singing stainless blade. I don't know why.

Its advantage is that it doesn't rust so quickly as carbon steel and in all the reviews I have read and from my own experience, I have not seen any disadvantages. Some think they are difficult to hone. I think all razors are difficult to hone and the stainless is no exception.(If you want difficult, try a full wedge)

Look at the DE razors. The carbon steel blades were replaced by stainless blades and now platinum coated stainless blades. The carbon steel blades gave a great shave but they only lasted two or three shaves before the rust had blunted them beyond use. Stainless DE blades last up to ten days for many men.

I think stainless razors are tomorrows world.

Anyway, that's my 2p's worth.