Thread: New Wade & Butcher Question

Thank you very much, guys!
To stay in topic.. When trying to arrange a timeline for my blades I realised that "finding a year" for victorian blades is much more difficult than for older ones. Is it the same for you? I feel that the period 1790-1840 was really "special", full of big and fast changes in tastes that can allow a precision of ±3 years when dating blades. For the second half of XIX century the task is so difficult that sometimes precision arrives to ±20 years! ..and this is the case for many Wade&Butchers.

Originally Posted by holli4pirating

The stamp indicates that the razor was made during the Reign of Queen Victoria, but I don't know the years offhand. A very nice looking blade, though she's almost certainly been reground (not a negative at all, since the grind looks well done, just something to note).

I wonder whether the VR marking indicates that this is an item made for Victoria's own household? Perhaps a razor was issued to servants as a part of their equipment. I looked on line for a list of livery in Victoria's household but didn't find anything. I wonder if there is an historian out there who could comment on the possibility?

Best Regards

goshawk

Originally Posted by clavichord

I'd like to answer "No", but..
My #56-58 have a similar mark.

Beautiful.

I'm just starting out and I was interested in a blade I could shave with, but I like the historical aspect and after seeing all the different pieces they really are works of art.

Maybe what I'll do is see if I can get some nice scales for it to replace the plain black.

Originally Posted by goshawk

I wonder whether the VR marking indicates that this is an item made for Victoria's own household? Perhaps a razor was issued to servants as a part of their equipment. I looked on line for a list of livery in Victoria's household but didn't find anything. I wonder if there is an historian out there who could comment on the possibility?

Best Regards

goshawk

I would think that if this was the case, the razors would be less commonly found, more ornate, and better documented. I have seen other posts that said it was simply a sign that the razors were made during the reign and possibly with a royal warrant, but that seems to be the extent of it.

Originally Posted by holli4pirating

I would think that if this was the case, the razors would be less commonly found, more ornate, and better documented. I have seen other posts that said it was simply a sign that the razors were made during the reign and possibly with a royal warrant, but that seems to be the extent of it.

I'm not sure I agree with you. Victoria's household was extensive even by the standards of her day. If razors were bought to be issued to to footmen, coachmen, valets et al, they would probably have been quite plain and there certainly would have been hundreds of them over the years of her reign. I still think it's a possibility.

Best Regards

goshawk

I think that the practice of razor marks could come from silver and makers' marks. Here a paragraph regarding duty marks:

In 1784 the duty mark was created to indicate a tax on the item had been paid to the crown. The mark used was a profile portrait of the reigning monarch's head. The use of this mark was abolished in 1890.

I can't say that there was a tax on razors/steel and from that duty marks on the shank, but for sure a silver spoon with a monarch's head doesn't mean that it was made for the monarch's own household.

@ goshawk: nice signature!

I was doing a little more research based on information I got from clavichord. This teapot had a makers mark of V R and a crown and it is from Sheffield. The person dates it between the 1850's and 1880's. Thanks again clavichord. Here's a pic:

Yes, razors W&B with such stamp meet infrequently. I'm sure that it's not connected with Victoria's household. Most likely, razors with such stamp were issued in 1845. When William Butcher became a member of The Company of Cutlers in Hallamshire, serving as the Master Cutler.

And in general this stamp V(crown)R meets very often. It was used by the various organisations. For example, on beer cups to assure that in a cup exactly pint, instead of is less.

I took the liberty and posted a question concerning the crown and VR stamp on the British Blades website. Maybe we can find a bit more information on these logo's. I am interested in this because I have 2 straight with no name that have the crown and VR stamped on it as well.
the only markings on the tang is:
SILVER STEEL
WARRANTED
The crown and letters are on the left side of the tang.