Thread: Dealing with rust

Originally Posted by Morty

Where do you store your razors? Do you keep them in the bathroom? Some bathrooms remain more humid than others. Humidity (water vapor) contributes to rust also. I keep my razors in the linen closet in the hall outside my bathroom.
Namaste,
Morty -_-

I'm in a dorm right now, so I keep them in my room. Could it be that my room is especially humid? The window is usually open and only recently has New York started getting a bit humid.

Some threads I read here on SRP referenced some microscopic studies of razor edges. As I recall, the research was from the 1930s or thereabouts. Could be wrong. What I do remember is the statement that on the microscopic level, rusting - even when not visible to our eye - was as much an enemy of a sharp edge as shaving!

I think I remember that correctly...

If you looked at those tiny, almost insignificant spots under a high-powered microscope, you would see something that resembeld a pock-marked lunar landscape. Any place where rust has formed will present a mico-environment where it will form again. Drying the area is a bit problematical - water gets trapped in these tiny pockets, the pH alters, and the area contributes to its own destruction. The pH level becomes more acidic.

Covering over these pits with something that stops the water evaporating - any type of oil - is a bad idea if all the vapour has not been driven off.

I haven't had that problem thank goodness, but I make sure that my razors are really dry before I even close the blade. When I finish shaving, the blade is held in the sink of hot water to get warm, then dried and left open in a dry area - not the bathroom. Later - sometimes the next day - it is stropped, closed and put back in the rotation.

Perhaps stabilisation before drying is the answer - a strong base solution of sodium carbonate (baking soda) or sodium carbonate - 5% by volume - in a rinse of pure water (rainwater/deionised/distilled) water would work for you, you would only need 5g per 95ml of water.

Regards,
Neil

Originally Posted by Neil Miller

If you looked at those tiny, almost insignificant spots under a high-powered microscope, you would see something that resembeld a pock-marked lunar landscape. Any place where rust has formed will present a mico-environment where it will form again. Drying the area is a bit problematical - water gets trapped in these tiny pockets, the pH alters, and the area contributes to its own destruction. The pH level becomes more acidic.

Covering over these pits with something that stops the water evaporating - any type of oil - is a bad idea if all the vapour has not been driven off.

I haven't had that problem thank goodness, but I make sure that my razors are really dry before I even close the blade. When I finish shaving, the blade is held in the sink of hot water to get warm, then dried and left open in a dry area - not the bathroom. Later - sometimes the next day - it is stropped, closed and put back in the rotation.

Perhaps stabilisation before drying is the answer - a strong base solution of sodium carbonate (baking soda) or sodium carbonate - 5% by volume - in a rinse of pure water (rainwater/deionised/distilled) water would work for you, you would only need 5g per 95ml of water.

Regards,
Neil

Hmm... alkali can invite rust as quick as acid can.
any salt can also help rust get into steel.

Neil has an important point steel is porous and we forget that...

There are three discussions hidden in previous posts by many folk.

• what removes rust spots?
• what prevents rust from returning?
• what day to day care works?

To remove the rust a very fine abrasive is needed.
This abrasive can be common paper or a polishing
agent like MAAS. If I smell MAAS I smell ammonia
or something like it that eventually needs to be cleaned
away.

Once the rust has been cleared prevention begins.

First the steel needs to be cleaned. In part MAAS
will have done this. The rest of the blade also needs
to be cleaned too. A modern detergent can
clean off a variety of nasty greases including fingerprints.

Next the surface needs to be covered with a
layer that excludes oxygen in the air and does
not react with the steel. The surface moisture
needs to be displaced from the micro cracks that
are the locus for corrosion and rust to begin.

In this regard there is an initial battle where
WD-40 and even 99% alcohol can get down
to the metal and dry the surface. WD-40
contains some oil so once the moisture is
displaced a thin oil is left. 99% alcohol needs
to be promptly followed by a barrier substance
like mineral oil, Camilla oil. The same is true
following honing the edge. BTW, I think the
secret oil in WD-40 is a fish oil the same as
Rust-Oleum paint once contained.

Since strops are commonly treated with wax
and or oil so the fine edge gets lightly sealed in
the normal course of sharpening.

The ingredients of WD-40 are secret and
as such it is hard to recommend it where
it will come in contact with skin that has
been "challenged" by a razors nicks. I do
like it for the pivot area of a razor. I wipe
it off the blade promptly and replace it
with mineral oil or camilla oil. Right after
honing a razor I find I have more "stray" water
and as such WD-40 has it's place at the
end of a honing session, especially on the pivot,
shank and associated jimps.

Once the steel surface is clean and protected lesser procedures
will often suffice for maintenance.

After shaving I find that residual soap and
the extra oils in hyper fatted soaps and creams
gets me by in the day to day thing but my water
has almost no dissolved solids.

If I hone, strop then store blades I always
try to end up with a final spray of camilla oil that is
not wiped down. I slop more water on a blade in
the process of honing than shaving...

Vaseline should be a good thing. It is commonly
applied to cuts and it does seal out air. Mineral
oil is also inert in much the same way. The key
is the steel needs to be clean and dry prior to
the application. And later the razor needs to be
cleaned well enough that it is not slippery in
the hand.

Celluloid scale rot is nasty stuff and should not
be discounted on old razors (post 1850). One
hint is to keep the razor in zip locked bag and then
smell the air in the bag a day or two later. Another hint is to
keep a suspect razor in a cup open to the air so
the fumes do not build up.

Just one opinion, sorry for being long winded.

Originally Posted by niftyshaving

Hmm... alkali can invite rust as quick as acid can.
any salt can also help rust get into steel.

That's a good point, Tom! Maybe if a base solution was used to neutralise any acid build-up, the blade could then be rinsed again in distilled/deionised water before thorough drying. The disadvantages of all these steps is the time and effort involved, which is a bit off-putting. Putting paid to those pesky rust spots once and for all then just drying and coating would make life easier!

The salts I referred to are also used to modify tap-water. A lot of people have noted that rust can suddenly spring up on a blade while being honed and the tap water is often the culprit. Adding a bit of one of these salts to the tap water cures the problem. Obviously, not everyone has this problem so it must depend on the local water authority (what they put in the water) or seasonal differences affecting the chemicals entering groundwater and aquifers.

Sodium carbonate (washing soda) is also used to make up the electrolyte in an electrolytic method of rust removal. It is said not to affect good metal, but I have never tried it - I might give it a try over the weekend to see if it does work.

Regards,
Neil