Thread: Really in need of some coaching...

Sorry, forgot about the Maestro Livi/Takeda razors, and the Robert Williams razors. Both of them are very very hard as well (going by the L/T's rep, no direct experience).

Maybe the Dovo Bergischer Lowe? I've heard that one uses very hard steel. And some of the old Swedish framebacks are also hone-mockingly hard.

Originally Posted by mparker762

Sorry, forgot about the Maestro Livi/Takeda razors, and the Robert Williams razors

Michael the Merciless, we should call you

Come on, tell Josh he *can* use the Fruidur - in a pinch

Cheers
Ivo

Josh,

Yea thats probably it. I only do four or five strokes, in general, around the face. Thats probably a lot of the issue.

The more I thought about it today, on the commute in (how wierd is this hobby that I think about how you shave?) I think you should explore angle too. I'm still curious how the shave goes clean off the hone with no stropping. I don't think I clarified that this would be kind of like an experiment . . . that might get you more interested... LOL... anyway its a thought. I often strop with significant pressure, get smoothed out and then go with a light touch. But I find a light touch alone works fine for me too, so I"m not any real help here I suppose.

For the most part I only go XTG on the chin.

The Feather on day one was amazing. I got a very clean shave with no irritation whatsoever. I was even able to go against the grain under my chin, which is something that brings tears to my eyes with every other straight I've tried to this point.

Day two wasn't as good. I felt like I had to use some pressure; day one I was just trying to keep the weight of the thing off my face as much as possible. Maybe I wasn't as afraid of it the second time around. Whatever the reason, I had some low-level irritation. I'm planning to try it again soon, and I suspect it'll be slightly worse each time...

I have a hard time imagining that my beard is that hard to shave. After all, I do very well with low-end DE blades. I think it has to be some combination of pressure, angle, the direction of the strokes and the number of strokes.

Alan, I have shaved right off the hone or pasted strop a number of times, and it works OK but stropping does seem to improve it.

Tomorrow I'm going back to the DE to give my poor skin a break.

Thanks, and keep it coming,
Josh

If your truly positive about the razor and prep and all that then you described the problem and solution to yourself already. Its technique. I don't think the stropping idea is a good one. Stropping is the key to good shaving and has been for hundreds of years. I think to eliminate that is just not a good idea. Its one of the few factors in straight shaving that is written in stone.

I would be concentrating on your angle that you hold the blade. It might be too aggressive hence a rough shave. Really look at how your holding the razor as you shave. I find if I'm not paying attention I have a tendency to increase the angle as I shave.

Also I find when I do my chin I come straight down and around in one stroke. If you razor can't do that smoothly its a sign its not sharp enough. Also if you have to strop inbetween shaves thats saying to me maybe the razor isn't quite there and it either marginal to begin with and its failing during the shave.

For me the ultimate test if whether the razor is truly shave ready is when I get to my chin. It might shave my face fine but when I bring it down around my chin, if it starts to slow down or pull or balk I know it ain't ready.

Originally Posted by xman

Are you using a cutting angle, leading the shave stroke with the tip ahead of the heel? I find this very useful.

X

I want to underscore this. Lately, and particularly on my upper lip and chin, this cutting angle has been such an asset. It helps me get a smooth cut in the areas of my face where the hair is the most dense.

If you haven't tried it yet, I would recommend doing so next time you use a straight.

Originally Posted by JoshEarl

Alan, I have shaved right off the hone or pasted strop a number of times, and it works OK but stropping does seem to improve it.


Josh

Cool, then that, with the fact that your edges get better with stropping iterations is proof that your problem isn't in the stropping.

I knew someone was going to scan through that post and assume I thought you should stop stropping altogether.

Be careful though with tip leading strokes on protrusions like the chin.

I agree with Bigspendur, time to reevaluate honing. How do the DEs look in the microscope thats different than your honend edges?

I would suspect that if your holding the handle of a DE away from your face when shaving that your using too steep an angle when using a straight (for your face).

Hey, I've had an epiphany! Woo Hoo. Ya know both the Feather straight and a DE have one thing in common. Pressure against the face. If you use pressure with a Feather, you remove your face and a DE has a blade guard. Maybe you need to simply work on skin stretching and moving the blade lightly into the whiskers without pressing into the skin so much.

Whatcha think of that?

My DE shave this morning went pretty well. I know that it's pretty different from shaving with a straight, but I find the knowledge transfers well back and forth between the two tools.

Today I found myself lightening up on the pressure and reducing the cutting angle even more than I have in the past. My recent experiments with the Feather and regular straights have taught me what too much pressure and bad blade angles feel like.

I got a near-BBS shave in most places, even though I wasn't pushing since the whole point here is to let my skin heal up. My face feels much better today, maybe 95 percent healed. A couple more days and I'll be good as new. I'm hoping that this is part of my problem.

I'm going to pay very close attention to how I shave my chin with the DE. Today I was a little rushed, but I did notice that I kind of "chip away" at the stubble. I start under my lip and work my way down in 1/2 inch strokes. After the first pass, I still have tons of stubble left--almost like I didn't shave. Then I relather and redo the WTG pass, maybe even a couple of times. Each time I work my way further into the stubble on the point of my chin and just underneath it, which is the really bothersome stuff. It's like the way you'd clear a forest with a machete--hack a little deeper each time.

If I can improve on this to where I'm able to just do smooth strokes with the DE, maybe I'll be able to transfer that into my straight technique. I suspect different/better skin stretching and more attention to the grain will help.

Bigspendur, I understand what you're saying about sharpness and doing one smooth stroke on the chin, but I have never been able to do that--not with my razors, not with the Feather, not with a DE, not with honemeister razors.

Thanks for all the suggestions--I'm digesting it all here.

Josh

Josh

Just a thought...

I always shave after I've showered. Somewhere I read that someone put hair conditioner on their beard in the shower after washing it with normal soap. I tried it with my wife's moisturing conditioner and it worked a treat, making the hair much softer (duh, that's what its supposed to do ).

I then lather and shave as usual...

Originally Posted by Savage

Josh

Just a thought...

I always shave after I've showered. Somewhere I read that someone put hair conditioner on their beard in the shower after washing it with normal soap. I tried it with my wife's moisturing conditioner and it worked a treat, making the hair much softer (duh, that's what its supposed to do ).

I then lather and shave as usual...

Yup- I do that every now and again. It does make the beard feel softer. It is really noticable if you haven't shaved in a few days and the wiskers are longer.