Thread: Spam Killers Alert

Originally Posted by Doc

just like the exclamation point found on the lower left hand of this screen.

Oh that little red thing... Let me try

Looks like spam:

http://straightrazorpalace.com/works...ish-blade.html

Last post.

Huh? Where?

Originally Posted by fritz

All the above are good ideas, but I think that a very useful thing would be a "Report Spam" button (similar to the "Thanks" button) that would notify the mods of a potential problem. There are, after all, many more users than mods.

as Doc so delicately put it, we do have a button to report bad posts...
that is where we go to report spam.

I'm just saying that banning them like they do now is like chasing a stray cat out of your yard. as soon as you go back inside, they come back.
We need a way to tag them as spammers so that they can't just make a new user name and post more.
That's why I want them tagged with a java cookie that is very hard to find and remove, and then redirected so they can't log out.
For the rest of us the transition to Java cookies would be pretty much seamless, We might come back, and find ourselves logged out, because the HTML cookies in use are no longer valid, but a good programmer can even work around that. Once it's switched to java cookies, the program administrator just needs to make minor changes to the message that is sent when a user is banned. Instead of sending them to a page on SRP that says you've been banned, send them to an outside link. such as...
spam.com

Because their ID is stored on a Java cookie, it isn't cleared with the regular history, or when deleting cookies, or even when restarting the computer.
Because they are automatically redirected before they can access the SRP web site, they can't log out.
In essence you haven't just locked them out, you've hidden the whole house from them.
It's hard to graffitti a wall that you can't see. and unless they read this thread before they get banned, they aren't going to know how they were banned, or even what to look for to bypass the bann.
If the administrator wanted to be subtle, and really comnfuse them, they could be redirected to something that is similar, so they think they misspelled the web address... Send them here, or here, or here...
It might take them a while to figure out what's going on.

You can also send them to something totally unrelated like this site

Thing is with the report button is that it takes time before the mods see it from what I can tell. I report spam every other day, and sometimes one of those pests manages to post another 15-20 times or more before being cancelled. to make 15-20 posts takes 14-19mins +/- since there is a 60sec wait period between posts, now I know 20mins isn't very long, but when you realise that's 20 threads contaminated with how many subscriptions per thread, that people receive emails for. As some have mentioned in the past, they don't like receiving that nonsense in their emails.

My suggestion for the blocking IP addresses was simply coz that's what we would do on another site. I don't/didn't know about this shared IP issue. But whats the harm of banning IP's temporarily until a better solution is found? You can unblock/unban blocked IP's so its not like its a permanent measure.

I'm simply trying to offer a simple solution, even if it only serves as a tmporary measure until something better is implemented.

Originally Posted by Mike_ratliff

That only works if they have a static IP address...
It might stop them for a day or two, but it also runs the risk of cutting off any other members who are with the same carier.

They need to make SRP have a persistent cookie, maybe a java one that can be activated by a moderator for these spammers.
That way once a spammer is identified, the cookie can basically burn their identity into their computer, don't allow them to sign out, and make it automatically redirect them elsewhere when they try to open the site.

This isn't illegal, or immoral, it isn't even difficult. They come in as one id, spam, get banned, and the next time they try to access the site instead of seeing SRP come up on their screen, they are automatically redirected to Barney's web site...

and because the SRP cookie is made to be persistent, and to not allow them to log out they would have to erase the cookie before they can access the site again under a different ID. This is easy with regular cookies, but still takes time, with Java cookies, it's darn near impossible.

The plain and simple truth is these spammers don't have time to mess around with sites that fight back. They come in post until banned and move on to their next ID. Many of these spammers are probably the same individual with several member names.
Why should the Moderators have to bann the same guy 10 times a week.

So how would this work exactly? I don`t understand. How would someone differenciate between a spammer and a normal member when doing this cookie thing? Sounds much like you`d need to do it via an IP address, and if IP`s are shared how will it not affect several people?

I`m not exactly a computer wizz, so I just want to understand how this cookie thing would be any different/safer than banning an IP address. I`m willing to learn.

If you want to fight spam yourself sent this link This link kills spam to the email address

The way the cookie thing works is to hide an identifier on every member's computer, one that will recognise them, and can assist them by telling them if they have PMs, by keeping them logged in, etc... Almost every website out there uses these already.

When someone is marked by a moderator as a spammer, this same identifier will tell the SRP site to redirect them elsewhere so that they can't visit SRP anymore.
Instead of blocking by IP addresses, the Spammer's computer will jump up and tell us that it's been blocked. The moderators won't have to deal with the spamer, because he won't even be able to see the SRP web site.

For all of the regular members who aren't causing trouble, this identifier will serve to make their browsing of the site more convenient.

And by the way, these hidden identifiers are already on all of our computers.

The only change I'm suggesting is to use a better cookie, and to redirect them away from SRP so that they can't log off.
We can all erase the identifier, and log on as a different user, look at Spike and Silver, they share a computer, so their identifier changes between them.
This would stay the same, unless they couldn't get to the log off button.
So normal members like spike could still share their computer.
Spammers would be redirected before they could log off, so they would be stuck with the id that they were banned on.
With the current system you can get around this by clearing your cookies, if we use Java cookies, they would have a much harder time removing it, and first they would need to know what was causing the redirect, and then they would have to find the cookie and remove it manually. A very difficult prospect.

In essence what I am proposing is to turn the spammer's computer against them.
It is a precision block, and it's a self-enforcing restraining order.
It's an electronic cruise missile.

If SRP banned me today, I could easily log off, make a new identity, and be posting again within an hour.

If SRP were to switch over to the Java cookies, and redirect all banned members to an outside link, A bann ceases being a "sorry, you can't post thing", and becomes an iron clad, "you can't come in, you can't even see us thing".
Depending on how high up in the code the cookie identifier is placed, and how fast it works, they may see the SRP logo pop up at the top of the page before being sent elsewhere, or they may never see SRP at all ever again.

If they can't get on the sight to activate the log out command, they are left searching through thousands of files to try to figure out which one belongs to SRP, so they can hopefully delete the right one, and get back on the site.
Were talking hours or weeks of searching to find the right file, and if the admins are smart, they can actually have a redundant system that uses 2 cookies. You delete one, try to get on, and the second one restores the first, and still sends you packing.

This won't stop spammers, but it will prevent Mods from having to bann the same spammer more than once. And I highly doubt the spammers are going to put the time in to try to get back on after the first block. It's too much work when they can just move on.

Even with the knowledge I have, if this Java cookie and redirect policy was implemented, and SRP banned me, I would not be able to get back on. It would take me hours or possibly days to find and remove the cookie. And that's with me knowing exactly how they were blocking me.

Not only would this bann mean I couldn't post or spam, but if I was banned, I wouldn't even be able to read, or watch BST... There wouldn't be a work around, you couldn't link me to a post, because the second I tried to open it, I would be sent packing. For the banned person SRP would cease to exist on the net.
This type of ban is more than a slap on the wrist, it literally says don't ever come back. You can't mess around, and harrass anyone, or retaliate, you're out. The only way back in is to E-mail the admin and begg for forgiveness.



Old School, You were asking how this is different than an IP block... Think of an Ip address as a street address... Except, instead of using just one house, if you rent you can use whatever house is vacant on that street. By blocking one address, the spammer just moves to a new one. If a member moves into this address later, he is blocked.

The cookie block is like putting the block on the spammer's house key. He can go to any address, but as soon as he tries to access the site, his key activates the trap.
It would be the real world equivalent of tattooing spammer on his forehead. He can change his name, but the tattoo remains.

Using the Java cookie to block the spammer, is literally putting a red flag on the computer he is using. Regardless of where he moves it to, he can change networks, addresses, anything, that specific computer will not be able to gain access to SRP. If he has a second computer, he can gain access as long as he doesn't make the mistake of logging on under the banned id. If he spams from his second computer, and is banned, he now has 2 computers that can't see SRP.

How many computers can this guy own?

Originally Posted by Doc

just like the exclamation point found on the lower left hand of this screen.

Well, yes, now that you mention it... Perhaps it should be part of the intro material when someone first signs up?

We have a new spammer: poinex... Kill kill kill