Thread: Slurry Dulling

Originally Posted by S0LITARYS0LDIER

I think slurry dulling / slurry limiting should be used interchangeably.

I think the term dulling is completely misleading...it should only be limiting.

Here is a visual. There is a large field/pasture very flat but some rocks poking up here and there. Clearly it is a rocky soil. This is your hone.

By raising a slurry, you are taking all the rocks that lie within say a foot of the surface and putting them on top of the soil. Now the field is completely strewn with rocks.

Someone comes along an grabs you and begins dragging you behind a horse across the field, Not a fun time...The only way to improve your "ride" is by clearing those excess rocks off the field (diluting your slurry). The ride will never be better than the field is without the loose stones...Honing on water...the ultimate limit of your hone.

So reading back through many of the answers it seems like


Slurry Dulling is pretty much a Coticule thing
There is a bit of conjecture about dulling vs limiting
The idea of Particles actually "Bashing" into the Fin and dulling it is not widely accepted not disproved just not all that easily accepted
The idea of the slurry limiting how far the edge can go then Diluting/Breaking down the slurry and the edge getting sharper is more accepted..
The definition of "Sharper" is a bit vague
It seems that some want to believe it so much that they would do some pretty strange honing techniques to try and prove it.. Pretty much akin to taking and edge to 10k then slamming it down to 1k just to say "Look I dulled it"


Some really detailed thinking in this thread I am enjoying the reads so far

Originally Posted by gssixgun

So reading back through many of the answers it seems like


Slurry Dulling is pretty much a Coticule thing
There is a bit of conjecture about dulling vs limiting
The idea of Particles actually "Bashing" into the Fin and dulling it is not widely accepted not disproved just not all that easily accepted
The idea of the slurry limiting how far the edge can go then Diluting/Breaking down the slurry and the edge getting sharper is more accepted..
The definition of "Sharper" is a bit vague
It seems that some want to believe it so much that they would do some pretty strange honing techniques to try and prove it.. Pretty much akin to taking and edge to 10k then slamming it down to 1k just to say "Look I dulled it"


Some really detailed thinking in this thread I am enjoying the reads so far

That's funny, in reading back through this thread I see something a bit different.
It's funny how two people reading the same posts come up with different conclusions.

I have a question for the Jnat folks. I will stay with my metaphor...

You seem to feel that the Jnat grit does break down finer and finer. If that is the case, why do you clear the rocks from your field and bring in a succession of smaller rocks from the neighbors fields (different Naguras)?

Originally Posted by Splashone

I have a question for the Jnat folks. I will stay with my metaphor...

You seem to feel that the Jnat grit does break down finer and finer. If that is the case, why do you clear the rocks from your field and bring in a succession of smaller rocks from the neighbors fields (different Naguras)?

The base stone is the finisher, it is extremely hard and to hone on it only will take a lot longer than to grab a few softer in progression stones and create slurry with them.
The base stone slurry will work only for the final stage of the honing.

I never really understood the nagura progression thing to be frank, except as a traditional way to hone and as a cheaper way to hone. The way I see it it is just a normal honing progression with slurry rather than stones.

In any event, if slurry dulling is created by a build-up of sludgy undiluted abrasive particulates and metal filings sitting in front of the edge and banging into it I don't see how that can be unique to a coticule. Many, dare I say all, stones can be slurried and many, dare I say all, slurries can be undiluted (just don't add water). But from what I've been reading here, it appears it only occurs with cotis?

James.

Originally Posted by Jimbo

I never really understood the nagura progression thing to be frank, except as a traditional way to hone and as a cheaper way to hone. The way I see it it is just a normal honing progression with slurry rather than stones.

spot on IMHO

Originally Posted by Splashone

The ride will never be better than the field is without the loose stones...Honing on water...the ultimate limit of your hone.

But what if you were drug around long enough for the loose rocks to be broken down into pea gravel that now covered the large imbedded rocks? Just to continue the analogy.

No one has conclusively demonstrated that the abrasive grit does break down in any reasonable period of time...sure maybe after 1000 or 10,000 laps but we just aren't putting enough pressure on a finishing hone to break down crystals that are hard enough to remove steel.

Continuing the analogy...you would have long since expired.

The bottom line is that raising a slurry increases the density and apparent size of the abrasive elements in the hone. How can it not limit the sharpness achievable?

Originally Posted by Splashone

Someone comes along an grabs you and begins dragging you behind a horse across the field, Not a fun time...The only way to improve your "ride" is by clearing those excess rocks off the field (diluting your slurry). The ride will never be better than the field is without the loose stones...Honing on water...the ultimate limit of your hone.

"Someone comes along an grabs you and begins dragging you behind a horse across the field, Not a fun time... " What the...were do you live? See, this is precisely why I don't live in Az, around here people don't try stuff like that. In all seriousness, that is a phenomenal metaphor, the best yet. For the sake of the metaphor, I'm a stickler for comfort when it comes to my horse drawn rides- "The ride will never be better than the field is without the loose stones..." so I might wish for snow. Not a coticule relevant wish per say.. Though definitely on other naturals since it has come up.