Thread: My razor is too sharp???? I like a duller edge??

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Hone or paste past this mystery blade's max level of .47 then you would overhone and the edge fails at least that is what I am saying... in very simple form

Glen i agree with you on this 100%.
Basically you are saying you can get from razor certain sharpness after that edge just melts (ss blades) or just small chips forms (mostly 16k will do it). or bends over honing.
This is correct.

But there is some issues in here .
factor one
maker
steel
hardening how has been done. Example
some blade will never take a good edge LOVELY pakistany blades. etc.

Question???

Is there anyone who thinks there is more then say 2/100 of a micron between sharp and too sharp????

Originally Posted by hi_bud_gl

Glen i agree with you on this 100%.
Basically you are saying you can get from razor certain sharpness after that edge just melts (ss blades) or just small chips forms (mostly 16k will do it). or bends over honing.
This is correct.

But there is some issues in here .
factor one
maker
steel
hardening how has been done. Example
some blade will never take a good edge LOVELY pakistany blades. etc.

Yes exactly each razor has a max level period....

This has pretty much been proved to be around the .48 -.38 micron level by way of the papers the Mr.Parker has linked and most of us have read...

Originally Posted by hi_bud_gl

What else will improve cutting efficiency? cutting edge gets narrower and sharper as you go up to the grit's.
Some people may call it differently but that is the way sharpness increase.
Simple example you can get maximum edge from particular stone. Example if you get maximum sharpness from Ecsher after 100 strokes. you will not get any sharper even you make 100000 more strokes after 100 strokes?
You know why ? edge gets narrower as mush as escher can do (particular stone maximum ability) after that using escher is nonsense . if you want to get more sharper you have to use another brand better final edge putting stone .
This is what i have experienced .

There is another way of interpreting what you are experiencing.

You get maximum sharpness out of escher after 100 strokes. The edge is as narrow as the escher can get it, but this is the same narrowness as the 4k norton, 8k norton, coticule, nakayama, shapton, etc. But the bevel is as polished as the escher can get it - you have removed all significant irregularities in the bevel from the lower grit hones, and the escher just isn't polishing it any finer. If you wish to get sharper then you need to move to a hone that will leave a finer more smooth bevel on the razor that will lower the effort involved in splitting the whiskers open.

The effect of these two interpretations on the shave is exactly the same - two hones produce different levels of sharpness. The difference is in the explanation. In yours the hone produces sharpness by reducing the size of the bevel to it's minimumlevel, in mine the hone produces sharpness (beyond the 4k point) by improving the level of polish to it's smoothest level.

Since we can't tell the difference between these two theories by shaving, we must turn to another way. Like looking at them under an electron microscope to see if the edge does indeed get thinner as we move to finer grit hones, or if the level of polish does indeed improve as we move to finer grit hones.

When Dr. Verhoeven did this, he found that the edge did not get thinner past about 4k, but the level of polish and consistency of the bevel kept improving past 4k.

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Question???

Is there anyone who thinks there is more then say 2/100 of a micron between sharp and too sharp????

Sure, if that 2/100ths is teflon :-)

Originally Posted by hi_bud_gl

But there is some issues in here .
factor one
maker
steel
hardening how has been done. Example
some blade will never take a good edge LOVELY pakistany blades. etc.

Verhoeven also looked at steel hardness and edge thickness and found a correlation there, though it wasn't huge. But he only looked at I think 58-64hrc steel not the cast iron that the pakistanis use.

Pulls out me Teflon impregnated strop,

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Pulls out me Teflon impregnated strop,

I tried spraying a Le Grelot with PAM and it didn't help.

Originally Posted by mparker762

There is another way of interpreting what you are experiencing.

You get maximum sharpness out of escher after 100 strokes. The edge is as narrow as the escher can get it, but this is the same narrowness as the 4k norton, 8k norton, coticule, nakayama, shapton, etc. But the bevel is as polished as the escher can get it - you have removed all significant irregularities in the bevel from the lower grit hones, and the escher just isn't polishing it any finer. If you wish to get sharper then you need to move to a hone that will leave a finer more smooth bevel on the razor that will lower the effort involved in splitting the whiskers open.

The effect of these two interpretations on the shave is exactly the same - two hones produce different levels of sharpness. The difference is in the explanation. In yours the hone produces sharpness by reducing the size of the bevel to it's minimumlevel, in mine the hone produces sharpness (beyond the 4k point) by improving the level of polish to it's smoothest level.

Since we can't tell the difference between these two theories by shaving, we must turn to another way. Like looking at them under an electron microscope to see if the edge does indeed get thinner as we move to finer grit hones, or if the level of polish does indeed improve as we move to finer grit hones.

When Dr. Verhoeven did this, he found that the edge did not get thinner past about 4k, but the level of polish and consistency of the bevel kept improving past 4k.

Now i am getting whole confused.
will you please explain what you mean by Polishing?
in my opinon BEVEL has nothing do to with sharpness of the blade. Edge does .edge touches to the cutting surface not bevel.
Polishing removes the metal right? as doing so it narrows the edge. makes them come to more close to 'V' shape. and this will increase sharpness.
May be that person was making experiment of chizels axes, knifes etc .
that is different . you don't have to get v edge on them as you know it will get so fragile and useless .

Originally Posted by JimmyHAD

I tried spraying a Le Grelot with PAM and it didn't help.

It's a french razor - it needs real butter.