Thread: C'mon people, calm down (yet another Filly post)

There may be a very few production razors that are worth $500 in close to mint condition, a Puma Gold comes to mind. But such razors are few and far between. The various Filly models don't seem to be that rare, just concentrated with a couple of sellers that are smart enough not to flood the market all at once, keeping demand high.
A custom AT34 Livi recently sold for just over $350 and a Livi Takeda Damascus for around $550 on eBay, two Livi's just sold in BST for $475 each, there was a R. Williams for $600.
The ESBD is into mildly used custom razor pricing.

Originally Posted by nightbreed

So pleased that I made the move when they was 200 - 250 Yeah, I know rubbing it in....

+1! I've got the pretty blue one - and yes, it is fantastic!

Originally Posted by Hawkeye5

There may be a very few production razors that are worth $500 in close to mint condition, a Puma Gold comes to mind. But such razors are few and far between. The various Filly models don't seem to be that rare, just concentrated with a couple of sellers that are smart enough not to flood the market all at once, keeping demand high.
A custom AT34 Livi recently sold for just over $350 and a Livi Takeda Damascus for around $550 on eBay, two Livi's just sold in BST for $475 each, there was a R. Williams for $600.
The ESBD is into mildly used custom razor pricing.

I'll be the voice of dissent once again in regard to NOS vintage razors that will never be made again (and no, I'm not one of the sellers of the Fillys nor do I stand to gain anything from them. I don't even own a Filly of any model):

The reaction that most of us have and have had perennially is comparing the current prices of these razors and other jaw dropping mint NOS razors that show up on occasion from other makers with the general price of vintage razors as they've been at a previous time, be it a year, two, three + etc. Absolutely this is a valid and logical comparison to make.

Here's the perspective I look at this type of trend at:
The likelihood that Filarmonica will resume production and of the same models, steel, quality, etc is effectively nil. There's a finite number regardless of how many there appear to be now. In that regard they're highly valued collectibles. And, in that condition they WILL only increase in value. How many times will we see the MINT NOS DDs, C-MONS, Beau Brummels come up for sale in the future? Guys, they're getting closer to a needle in a haystack every day.

Customs are true artisan pieces that in look, design, etc that are certainly in a separate class than production razors of present or of the past. However any straight razor collector now and in the future will know and seek out the makers I cited above; Will all collectors in the future know and regard currently known custom makers with equal import? Maybe. Hopefully. But maybe not.

I guess that's my long winded way of saying I'm still surprised NOS vintage razors sell for less than customs in most cases.

Chris L

Originally Posted by ChrisL

Here's the perspective I look at this type of trend at: The likelihood that Filarmonica will resume production and of the same models, steel, quality, etc is effectively nil. There's a finite number regardless of how many there appear to be now. In that regard they're highly valued collectibles. And, in that condition they WILL only increase in value. How many times will we see the MINT NOS DDs, C-MONS, Beau Brummels come up for sale in the future? Guys, they're getting closer to a needle in a haystack every day.

Just to put things into perspective, here is a number of mint NOS razors: Raritäten der Woche Galerie.

That said, I don't mind collectors paying these prices. I've never understood acquisition disorders. I don't think having an obsessive-compulsive disorder is something to be taken lightly, nor to be made fun about. But, as I said, that's a problem the collectors have to deal with, not mine. My "problem" is the way these razors are presented by some (usually well-to-do but inexperienced) members as if they were a guarantee for successful shaving.

And that's bollocks. B-o-l-l-o-c-k-s.

A $350 Thäter brush will not turn your soap into lather.

A $400 Coticule will not make your razor shave ready.

And a $500 Filarmonica will not deliver a close shave.

First, they all have to work in unison for a shave to be successful. Second, if any of them are sub par, so will be the shave. Last, it all depends on the hand wielding any of these high priced toys (and I consider them luxury toys, because there are much cheaper, and equally workable, solutions available).

I still maintain that verdicts like "this is a great razor", or "this razor shaves well" are nonsense. "Great" compared to what? I have 4 razors I would never under any circumstances trade for a Filarmonica. Are they great razors that shave well? Well, they are quality razors (especially the scales), and I manage good shaves with them. That's about it, though. Like many of us who have tested more than the occasional razor, I have a number of no name razors that are well able to produce similarly good shaves. So, as I said, the above verdicts are nonsense. Too many variables involved and all that.

Mind you, I would say the same about most other NOS razors. A Puma Gold would clearly be different because they really are rare. Filarmonicas are not, at least by collectors standards.

Robin

I'd never trade any of my razors for a Filli, and at those prices I wont be bidding for one either.

I find it hard to believe that they shave THAT much better than a DOVO or TI to justify the price difference. Its not even like the money is going on the scales and trim, most of the Filli's I've seen on eBay have fairly ordinary looking plastic scales and little work on the blade.

On pure visuals alone, these Filli's dont look that much different to a DOVO Best Quality, which sell for about $80. So we're talking about the shave being $440 better?

I'm not an expert by any stretch of the imagination, and I dont doubt that Filli's shave very well, but are they really worth that much extra cash?

Or is this purely a mixture of hype and limited supply?

If someone were to do a blindfolded shave test (risky! ), would they be able to tell the difference between a Filli and a DOVO Bismarck for example? Purely by the feel of the razor on the skin? And then would they be prepared to pay the extra $400 for the Filli?

Originally Posted by BeBerlin

That said, I don't mind collectors paying these prices. I've never understood acquisition disorders. I don't think having an obsessive-compulsive disorder is something to be taken lightly, nor to be made fun about. But, as I said, that's a problem the collectors have to deal with, not mine.

The current NOS Filarmonica prices are clearly a collector phenomenon. Used Filarmonicas don't go for these prices. I see used #14s routinely for $150 - about what you'd pay for any similar quality used razor in the #14's size class, and often less than W&B choppers or big Dorkos in similar condition.

But I agree with ChrisL on quality NOS razors, and their inherent rarity and value. There will always be occasional NOS razors that pop up of any brand, but the current near-daily parade of NOS Filarmonicas will not last indefinitely. It may go on five more years, or may end tomorrow - that's the bet that's driving this, I think.

Ironically, my own first post about Filarmonicas on SRP was to ask "So what's up with these Filarmonicas I see? Why do people consistently pay so much for them, anyway?"

Originally Posted by BeBerlin

I still maintain that verdicts like "this is a great razor", or "this razor shaves well" are nonsense. "Great" compared to what?

I certainly respect your greater experience level, and read and learn a lot from your posts, but I disagree here. Maybe in time, with more experience, I'll share your opinion. But of the razors I have, using the same honer, stropper, latherer, and shaver (...me), some are clearly superior shavers. Filarmonica certainly isn't the only one. Le Grelot, Otto Busch, Henckels Friodur, Greaves, and S.R. Droescher also come to mind, but Filarmonicas are definitely in the top of that top tier for me. Sharing these sorts of opinions, and reading those of others, are why I come here. If all razors (or hones, strops, brushes, soaps, creams) are essentially the same, then ...?