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Thread: Am I going in the right direction?

  1. #1
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    Default Am I going in the right direction?

    Hey all
    I'm new to straights having found my grandfather's krop.

    What do you all think of the science of sharp easy straight razor honing protocol?

    How straight should a hanging strop be? I'm thinking about the deflection of this strop from downward pressure of the blade.

    How much blade pressure do you all use when stopping?

    Thanks!
    Matt

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    I also made a strop out of 8 oz latigo, it's 3 in wide, and roughed up with 600 grit sandpaper and oiled. Do you think it needs a backer for stability?

    Do I need to treat it in some way?

    Is a beginner bought strop different in some way?
    Thanks
    Matt

  3. #3
    Senior Member blabbermouth outback's Avatar
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    Being your new to it all, it'd be best for you to look into our library for use and care for strops. Educate yourself in the subject.

    And for sure, don't use an heirloom strop till your proficient at the use and care, of a strop. Best to slice up a couple cheep strops while learning
    Mike

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    The Great & Powerful Oz onimaru55's Avatar
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    Hi there. Grats on the heirloom . Hopefully it's in good condition & you can hand it on again. Kropp's are quite good shavers.

    As for the science of sharp easy straight razor honing protocol, it doesn't seem so easy to me, cheap yes, easy not so much.
    I doubt you'll find anyone here who shaves off a 4k stone even if that edge is stropped with compounds etc it is still a 4k edge.
    There was a thread some time back where people shaved off their 1k bevel set. Great way to test your honing but not the most comfortable way to shave. 4k is only a bit better.
    I'm one of those guys that's collected expensive fine grit stones over decades but if it came to simplifying I could get by finishing on a pasted strop after 12k.

    There is always some deflection on a hanging strop & that ensures the edge is in contact. It's less of a concern than poor technique where you nick the strop which damages the edge on the flip.
    I'm guessing downward pressure would be around 150 grms. I do 50 -70 laps but it's all relative.

    Check this link re stropping & watch the videos at the bottom:
    https://shavelibrary.com/w/Razor_stropping

    A shame you had to sand the latigo . Was it damaged ? Are you sure it doesn't have any residual 600 grit particles. It's always a risk when sanding leather. The grain side of latigo is often quite suitable for a strop.
    “The white gleam of swords, not the black ink of books, clears doubts and uncertainties and bleak outlooks.”

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    Moderator rolodave's Avatar
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    Hi Matt
    Welcome to the forum.

    Add your town to the avatar. A member may live near you.

    We have quite a few members who hone for a small fee. I would send your Krop out for professional honing so you have a benchmark. Knowing what is shave ready is a big step in this hobby.

    As said, there is a ton of info here.

    Have fun and ask questions
    RezDog likes this.
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    Senior Member blabbermouth PaulFLUS's Avatar
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    Yes Kropp is quite good and it is always nice to have an heirloom. Post up some pictures either here or in this thread.
    https://sharprazorpalace.com/razors/...-heirloom.html

    We love pictures.

    If you are new I would recommend getting at least one other good used razor. You really should have more than one for a rotation but also you don't want to practice honing and especially not restoration on your heirloom. Better to make mistakes on one you have no sentimental attachments to. Check the buy sell trade (BST) section here. There are many good sellers here and you are going to get something that is not honed out or damaged or just plain junk. Bouschie often has good deals on razors and they come shave ready.
    onimaru55, 32t, RezDog and 1 others like this.
    Iron by iron is sharpened, And a man sharpens the face of his friend. PR 27:17

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    DZEC (01-13-2023)

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    Senior Member blabbermouth
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    The Science of Sharp provides good info on what happens to a razor edge when it is honed and stropped. The members of this forum would most likely not be happy with the edge his method of honing produces. I’ve noticed that the shaving edge I get using a progression of stones up to 12-15K is more satisfactory that going from 4K to compound laden strop. I do use CrOx to refresh an edge once it seems to start to pull.

    If you’ve not used a straight before, you really should have it honed by someone who knows what they are doing so you have a baseline for what a proper “shave ready” razor should feel like. You should also practice SLOW stropping technique on a learner strop so you can develop the muscle memory needed to strop correctly or you are likely to damage your good strop and the shaving edge of the razor. It’s not rocket science, but it does require deliberate practice before it comes naturally. I’m sure we’ve all nicked at least one strop as we learned.

    Then you have to develop your shaving technique. That takes time and depends on how your beard grows - coarseness of the beard, direction of the beard grain, angles of your facial features, etc. Most straight razor shavers cut themselves when they have a lapse of concentration, poor technique or a poorly sharpened razor, so be patient and pay attention to prepping your beard and moving the razor across your skin. Take your time and watch some instructional videos.
    David
    “Shared sorrow is lessened, shared joy is increased”
    ― Spider Robinson, Callahan's Crosstime Saloon

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    MrZ
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    DZEC has nailed it.
    All I can add is to not be afraid of cutting yourself. You absolutely will cut yourself, but its no big deal. And go slow while stropping, this isnt a drag race. Not much pressure when stropping or shaving seems to work well for me. Watch your angle and all is good.
    outback and DZEC like this.

  10. #9
    Senior Member blabbermouth PaulFLUS's Avatar
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    Yeah, I agree. David pretty well said it about that guy's method. I just read through it and there is some interesting stuff that he talks about and those 10,000 power photos are intellectually stimulating but not really very useful for more than conceptual analysis. Think of it in this way. If you looked at the pages of a book through, let's just arbitrarily say a 50x microscope what would you see? You could see that the paper looks like engineered plywood or that it is not as smooth as it looks to the naked eye and that the ink actually stands up on the page a little or that the edges of the letters are not perfectly straight but either choppy or it runs in imperceptible rivulets through the grain of the pulp. It would be interesting and even insightful, the things that you saw, but you couldn't see the words or what the words said. Remember that science is good but it has it's limits as to it's usefulness especially in the arts and there is some art to honing.

    I also have to differ with his characterization of forums as being "opinion," at least to the extent that he colors it as opinion exclusively. There is definitely opinion here but there is also some very thorough analysis with some very scientific tools and methods. Look around and I think you'll agree.

    I don't want to give the impression that I am dismissing his methods as some of what he says seems very useful but I do believe that the end product would, as David said, not be sufficient for most of us here. Let's just say that I would be willing to do a blind test with one of his edges and one of mine or one honed by any one of a plethora of others from here and be quite confident that you could tell a noticeable difference. I get his premise. He is taking the scientific approach and aiming to define the microscopic character of the edge. He is not the first to do so. I would just submit that the caveman couldn't see antigens and knew nothing about them or how heat affected them but he did know that if he cooked his food or boiled his water it didn't make him sick. I would also wager that Wayne Gretzky never did a single physics equation on the ice but he still knew how to get the puck in the net.

    Perhaps more importantly he is trying to skip what he considers to be superfluous steps. Denim and paste, leather and spray are just not substitutes for higher grit stones. Sorry but they're not. You may get a passable product but not what we are after. Most of us here are looking to refine the shave to the best possible result. That doesn't happen by omitting stones up to at the bare minimum 8k (double the grit count he is stopping at) and many if not most here would argue higher than that and even then that would be a jumping off place to go to pastes or sprays.
    Last edited by PaulFLUS; 01-13-2023 at 03:46 PM.
    yondermountain91, MrZ and DZEC like this.
    Iron by iron is sharpened, And a man sharpens the face of his friend. PR 27:17

  11. #10
    Senior Member yondermountain91's Avatar
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    My very first strop was a SRP latigo, and despite numerous times being told to use a cheaper strop I went after it anyway. Long story short I just about cut the strop in half and gave myself 8 stiches. I most definitely did way more harm than any good stropping in the beginning. It seems so elementary some of this stuff, but man let me tell you, starting slow on a paddle strop or a strop laid on a table's edge and doing slow deliberate strokes would have saved me more than one bad shave, and a good bit of money getting razors re-honed. Thank goodness for this forum and some of the member's who repeatedly re-honed my razors out of the goodness of there hearts. Seriously though take all the good advice above, no one here is an authority on shaving, but darn it do they freaking know what there talking about. Reach out and get a properly honed razor from a member, or better yet send your razor to a member to get honed. And welcome to your new second home.
    -Laramie-
    "If the brakes don't stop it, something will"

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