Thread: California Burning

It is interesting that the, well documented history of the US Forestry Service and their origins, under the false pretense of Wildland Fire Suppression to create the National Park system. Lead to a forestry culture and policy of “management”, (Complete Fire Suppression) that many believe has caused the time bomb we see now, literally fueling the fires.

Added that forestry management has become an explosive political issue that Climate Change folks, Environmentalist and Conservationist use to promote political power.

This is not a Climate Change rant, yes climate does change, it always changes, but not managing California dying forest, for years has led directly to these fires or at least to their conflagration.

As political as this issue has become, I doubt that any correction or change is possible anytime soon. The fact that wildland fire fighting has become a year-round, multibillion-dollar industry, that like the “Military Industrial Complex” that President Eisenhower warned has become a monster of its own.

No fire, no pay, combine that with political movement/ power and rabid “conservationist and environmentalist” followings, no solutions are on the horizon.

Originally Posted by cudarunner

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/44...BB18Yntd?pfr=1

https://nypost.com/2020/09/14/oregon...six-more-cops/

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime...re/ar-BB18WVw6

Yep, crazy people

For anyone interested in checking their air quality, here's a link/it's basically for the USA but there seems to be some limited info elsewhere:
https://www.airnow.gov/?city=Pomeroy...WA&country=USA

Smoked Cabernet anyone?


Photo by John Burgess/The Press Democrat

Originally Posted by cudarunner

For anyone interested in checking their air quality, here's a link/it's basically for the USA but there seems to be some limited info elsewhere:
https://www.airnow.gov/?city=Pomeroy...WA&country=USA

Another good site for this worldwide is IQ air's "Air visual". Just do a search it's a great app.

Originally Posted by Euclid440

It is interesting that the, well documented history of the US Forestry Service and their origins, under the false pretense of Wildland Fire Suppression to create the National Park system. Lead to a forestry culture and policy of “management”, (Complete Fire Suppression) that many believe has caused the time bomb we see now, literally fueling the fires.

Added that forestry management has become an explosive political issue that Climate Change folks, Environmentalist and Conservationist use to promote political power.

This is not a Climate Change rant, yes climate does change, it always changes, but not managing California dying forest, for years has led directly to these fires or at least to their conflagration.

As political as this issue has become, I doubt that any correction or change is possible anytime soon. The fact that wildland fire fighting has become a year-round, multibillion-dollar industry, that like the “Military Industrial Complex” that President Eisenhower warned has become a monster of its own.

No fire, no pay, combine that with political movement/ power and rabid “conservationist and environmentalist” followings, no solutions are on the horizon.

Well you could argue that if they had been aggressively managing for fires for the last 50 or 60 years or more this would not be happening now and that might truly be the case however lack of rain and little humidity and insect infestations killing trees by the thousands and heavy winds and lightning strikes and stupid humans make for a deadly combination.

Considering the size of the nations forests aggressive management over the years would have cost a fortune. Would it have cost more than the price we are paying now? Who knows?

It's not like they have done nothing. The set controlled fires and build fire breaks all the time.

Missing the forest for the burning trees.

Forestry service has been investigating, more like tracking for years and have documented pattern and a steady increase as the “industry” grows to the point that fire season is year-round.

Interesting many of the large ancillary wildfire support services are owned by retired forestry service personnel. It is a closed industry Forestry doles out the contracts.

Have you ever wondered why a state like California, were these fires are year-round, does not have their own fixed wing aircraft, but lease them for billions and many large rotary aircraft as well?

Who owns the aircraft and ancillary services? Who is investigating a multibillion dollar growing firefighting industry? And who sets the “Complete Fire Suppression” policy?

And that is just the fixed wing program, food, lodging heavy equipment supplies, transportation and on and on. No-one questions cost, does it all start to sound like the military industrial complex, but we don’t rent tanks and submarines, do we?

And that is just California.

Forestry management is such a complex subject that you can get degrees in it.
However, there are examples of well managed forests that are healthy and actually increase in cubic meter of standing timber every year. If left natural, the result is often natural, wildfires are part of the natural cycle of forests. I personally don’t view it as management. People get upset about industrial activity in parks. However if well managed, industrial activity can actually increase the healthy of the forests that comprise most of what people see when they look at a park. This particular subject is not close enough to me to know the details of the what how and when. All I see is tragic results.

Yea, at our local university you can get degrees in forestry right up to a masters degree.

Lakehead University : Forestry Graduate Program (Master's)

Part of managing forests in Ontario is the setting of prescribed burns.

Bob

Originally Posted by Euclid440

Missing the forest for the burning trees.

Forestry service has been investigating, more like tracking for years and have documented pattern and a steady increase as the “industry” grows to the point that fire season is year-round.

Interesting many of the large ancillary wildfire support services are owned by retired forestry service personnel. It is a closed industry Forestry doles out the contracts.

Have you ever wondered why a state like California, were these fires are year-round, does not have their own fixed wing aircraft, but lease them for billions and many large rotary aircraft as well?

Who owns the aircraft and ancillary services? Who is investigating a multibillion dollar growing firefighting industry? And who sets the “Complete Fire Suppression” policy?

And that is just the fixed wing program, food, lodging heavy equipment supplies, transportation and on and on. No-one questions cost, does it all start to sound like the military industrial complex, but we don’t rent tanks and submarines, do we?

And that is just California.

Renting and leasing of just about everything in Govt both Federal and State is commonplace. Who do you think transports the mail cross country? It's contractors and fedex. The Govt leases buildings and leases people too. The military may not lease submarines but they use private carriers to transport troops all over the world. The list is endless.

It's well known there is a revolving door in congress and other agencies where Govt employees quit or retire and go to work for private interests in the same field and land contracts. It's just the way it is and has always been. The is nothing special about California and the wildfires as some outlier here.