Thread: Overpopulation....a threat or a myth?

Originally Posted by gregs656

I would like to see some information from a reputable source that the current global population is sustainable.

Population management schemes have not worked any where, they're a rubbish idea. You need to let nature run it's course. Any human involvemnet in activly changing the population does not work, we don't have the capacity to understand the implications of our actions. This overpopulation thing (which until I see information otherwise exists) will work it's self out - it will be a long night for every one, but it will.

How about the fact that it IS being sustained?

Offcourse the management schemes have not worked out. They're rubbish schemes set up and executed by selfish people.

I never said I expected someone to be able to do that. All I said was that the problem was that it's not being done right.

Originally Posted by gregs656

I do not believe there is any such thing as a downfall.

Whether you like it or not: the laws of biology apply to every living creature, man included. We like to think we conquered our natural enemies. Take e.g. HIV: 20 years down the line we still have no vaccine, HIV is becoming increasingly resistant to antiviral medication. Antibiotic resistance is on the increase etc.

Originally Posted by Kees

... We have virtually eliminated natural selection, allowing even the weak to not only to survive but to reproduce as well. Eventually that will weaken the entire human race and become our downfall. ...

Sounds like an endorsment for eugenics. I hope you're not going to suggest it as a soloution.

Don't think so. The development Kees describes is just a result of eugenics not being a solution and of a lack of insight.
LOL, Technocrats sound rude sometimes!

Originally Posted by Kees

Whether you like it or not: the laws of biology apply to every living creature, man included. We like to think we conquered our natural enemies. Take e.g. HIV: 20 years down the line we still have no vaccine, HIV is becoming increasingly resistant to antiviral medication. Antibiotic resistance is on the increase etc.

Sure. But I don't believe there is such as a downfall. There is just change, even the worse kind of change leads to good change.

I would hate for you to think I believe man is infallible, quite the opposite. I fully expect there to be a drastic change in the number of humans on this planet, hoping for it in fact. I just don't believe that is a downfall.

That's quite a difficult concept, and I didn't justify my first post and for that I appologise.

It may be being sustained at the moment, but is it sustainable - a subtle distinction perhaps - but an important one. And is it being sustained? a lot of people are dying in countries that do little else but grow cash crops for the west. I would also dispute there is anything particularly selfish about population policies, poorly thought out but not selfish so much.

Eugenics doesn't work because they're programs run by humans.

Originally Posted by joesixpack

Sounds like an endorsment for eugenics. I hope you're not going to suggest it as a soloution.

No I am not suggesting eugenics for the reason quoted below.

Originally Posted by gregs656

Eugenics doesn't work because they're programs run by humans.

We can do well with double the current population, BUT sacrifices must be made. No more fossil fuels. The oil companies don't like that. Less meat consumption. The factory farms don't like that. We, like good sheep, tend to do what we're told so currently there is danger which will likely turn into disaster.

Interestingly, shortly after those stats from the 80's population growth in the major western cities began to decline rapidly. It appears that many educated people living a modern lifestyle choose not to have children, or at least not to have nearly as many. There is good news out there and it gives me hope. I do believe it'll get worse before it gets better.

X

Originally Posted by xman

We can do well with double the current population, BUT sacrifices must be made. No more fossil fuels. The oil companies don't like that. Less meat consumption. The factory farms don't like that. We, like good sheep, tend to do what we're told so currently there is danger which will likely turn into disaster.

Interestingly, shortly after those stats from the 80's population growth in the major western cities began to decline rapidly. It appears that many educated people living a modern lifestyle choose not to have children, or at least not to have nearly as many. There is good news out there and it gives me hope. I do believe it'll get worse before it gets better.

X

Yes, this is a trend that seems to defy logic, but it has been demonstrated again and again. Birth rate is inversly proportional to prosperity. People living in developed countries choose tohave far fewer, or even no children. If you want the population to shrink, then give people jobs, prosperity, good sanitation, health care, and education. I know it may seem like a cruel thing to subject people to, but it's been very effictive in the developed world.

Seriously.

Originally Posted by gregs656

...

Eugenics doesn't work because they're programs run by humans.

No, Eugenics doesn't work because it's pseudo-science. It has nothing to do with the humanity (or the lack of humanity) of the people who run it.

Originally Posted by joesixpack

Yes, this is a trend that seems to defy logic, but it has been demonstrated again and again. Birth rate is inversly proportional to prosperity. People living in developed countries choose tohave far fewer, or even no children. If you want the population to shrink, then give people jobs, prosperity, good sanitation, health care, and education. I know it may seem like a cruel thing to subject people to, but it's been very effictive in the developed world.

Seriously.

no doubt!