Thread: About healthcare.

Originally Posted by thebigspendur

The hilarious thing is all the horrible things that detractors say would happen to you if the health plan passed are already happening to people x10 just that it's the private corporations who are doing it. I guess that makes it acceptable.

I find it unconscionable that human life is treated as a "commodity"--if it's not profitable to treat Joe Bloggs' cancer (let's assume it's expensive, whatever it is), he is allowed to die (by dropping coverage or denial of claims) to protect profits... You want death panels in this country, you already got 'em! How is that not a death panel?

And don't get me started on rate hikes...

Originally Posted by wpfontenot

I wonder what would happen if the USPS suddenly went away?

I ask my "hate the Government", "Government can't do anything right" friends that question and they are the first to say that would suck. Considering only the USPS is required to deliver to every address in the US, not a single private company is required to do that nor do they even come close.

Granted, it's not Health Care but I'm sure you get the idea.

Medicare: broke.
Medicaid: broke.
Social Security: broke.

What do they have in common? They were created by inept fools and they are run and administered by inept fools. Those who created it had hearts of solid gold.......and their hearts were much larger than their brains. The vast majority of those that created and voted for this bloat are dead and buried. They don't have to worry about it anymore. I do. So will my children.

What will the costs of these entitlements be in 30 years? How many trillions? The solution? ADD MORE! ANOTHER ENTITLEMENT! Oh, and somehow it's going to reduce the deficit? Huh? Somehow, I'm the idiot for not believing that this is going to help me in the long run and actually work!

If the USPS closed tomorrow, the market would open up and private enterprise would take over. It's going to cost more, but something would take its place.

Why does government suck? Name one government agency you rave about on a daily basis.....or maybe just once in your life. The military doesn't count because that's the only branch of government that's worth a lick.

Originally Posted by CableDawg

Medicare: broke.
Medicaid: broke.
Social Security: broke.

What do they have in common? They were created by inept fools and they are run and administered by inept fools. Those who created it had hearts of solid gold.......and their hearts were much larger than their brains. The vast majority of those that created and voted for this bloat are dead and buried. They don't have to worry about it anymore. I do. So will my children.

What will the costs of these entitlements be in 30 years? How many trillions? The solution? ADD MORE! ANOTHER ENTITLEMENT! Oh, and somehow it's going to reduce the deficit? Huh? Somehow, I'm the idiot for not believing that this is going to help me in the long run and actually work!

If the USPS closed tomorrow, the market would open up and private enterprise would take over. It's going to cost more, but something would take its place.

Why does government suck? Name one government agency you rave about on a daily basis.....or maybe just once in your life. The military doesn't count because that's the only branch of government that's worth a lick.

I'm proud of my public education and I'm thankful for the infrastructure our tax dollars have provided.

Where on the proposal does it say that your taxes will increase? Nowhere. American citizens pay the most per-capita in health care out of all the industrialized nations, and our health statistics are some of the worse. Even if taxes increased specifically for this reform -- which they won't -- you'd probably still pay less per year because your annual contributions to health care would be decreased.

You think health care reform is really going to affect our deficit either way? We're hemorrhaging money trying to maintain an overseas empire and that's okay because it's the military. Spending money to keep our soldiers in harm's way in a place that honestly has no affect on the rest of our citizens -- that's a good thing. But spending money to keep our citizens healthy and better our society is socialist!

Even without a public option, the reform bill will help us with new rules applied to the industry. Stop insurance companies from picking and choosing who they want to cover. Open up the market so that we all have access to the same insurers and the same plans, instead of being forced to use the dominant insurer in our geographical region. Make sure that private companies can't deny coverage to citizens for existing conditions.

The health of our citizens should be a right and not a privilege.

A peer-reviewed study recently released by scientists (not demagogues or itinerant moose hunters) conservatively estimated that 45,000 Americans die every year, not from incurable disease, not from lack of medical care, but from lack of access to coverage.

It never fails to astonish me that I have fellow countrymen who, in deriding plans that obviously work well in the civilized world, gladly condemn thousands of their own countrymen to a miserable UNNECESSARY death. What is a horror to the civilized world is a ho-hum free market miracle here. So much for "American Exceptionalism." We're apparently too dense to figure out how to provide access to healthcare to all our fellow Americans. Imagine that! The country that put a man on the moon is now reduced to being unable to make sure everyone can go to the doctor when they're sick.

More than anything, it's proof of the success of the right-wing in shaping the dialogue in this country while liberals/democrats sing kum-by-yah, and that's just sad.

I read about all the problems with health care and I hope to God that someone will start doing something with some sanity involved. For well over 20 years the American people have wanted tort reform, a sane border policy and medical care solutions. I live in California, we are going broke. California can't even sell bonds anymore. I live in the US and we are going broke. The US dollar is going to collapse if we don't stop spending the amount of money that we are spending with no intention of paying it back. Does any sane person believe that if the US dollar does collapse that there will not be global starvation? This is not a Dem. versus Republican issue. They have both been in power yet they refuse to gitter done because they are power hungry, greedy people that lose their way once they get to Washington. Sane people have got to sit down and get this done and we don't have to become a Nazi or Communist nation to accomplish this.


Take Care,
Richard

Originally Posted by commiecat

I'm proud of my public education and I'm thankful for the infrastructure our tax dollars have provided.

I'm pretty happy with the education I received, too. Mine was public as well.

Where on the proposal does it say that your taxes will increase?

The trillion or so dollars of spending I've read about in the news over the next ten years would be government spending. Unless they intend on borrowing or printing money, that's a tax increase because when the government spends money, it receives that money in the form of a tax. That's the way I see it. I could be wrong. I also don't have time to read the thousands of pages of health care legislation that are going to be passed regardless of vote or reconciliation.

American citizens pay the most per-capita in health care out of all the industrialized nations, and our health statistics are some of the worse.

The same exact statement also applies to public education on a cost per student basis. Compare the public school system with private schools and tell me if we need more government intervention or more money in public schools.

We're also the most obese nation. Maybe that has some effect? Can I blame McDonalds and Burger King for obesity or can I blame the obese person for eating too much? For me, it's about personal responsibility.

Even if taxes increased specifically for this reform -- which they won't -- you'd probably still pay less per year because your annual contributions to health care would be decreased.

You think health care reform is really going to affect our deficit either way? We're hemorrhaging money trying to maintain an overseas empire and that's okay because it's the military. Spending money to keep our soldiers in harm's way in a place that honestly has no affect on the rest of our citizens -- that's a good thing. But spending money to keep our citizens healthy and better our society is socialist!

Health care reform of this magnitude may not affect the deficit in the short term, but in the long term I would think it's inevitable. It's an entitlement. Like all entitlements, it will always and forever be there and it will never get smaller and the costs will always go up.

Keeping soldiers in harms way to prevent another 911 is a good idea, in my opinion. The President had enough votes and enough authority to stop it on day one. Instead, he escalated it. Could it be that the man who would probably fail a simple FBI background check now has access to information that the rest of us don't? They keep voting to fund it!

Spending money to keep our citizens healthy and better is most definately socialist. Their health is not my responsibility. I feel like the lone person in the wilderness when I think that my health is my problem, not yours.

Even without a public option, the reform bill will help us with new rules applied to the industry.

More government intervention. Some good, some bad. It's all opinion.

Stop insurance companies from picking and choosing who they want to cover. Open up the market so that we all have access to the same insurers and the same plans, instead of being forced to use the dominant insurer in our geographical region. Make sure that private companies can't deny coverage to citizens for existing conditions.

Best ideas yet! I couldn't agree more. Putting it into practice? Not so easy. Somebody is going to get the shaft. That's probably going to be you and me.

The health of our citizens should be a right and not a privilege.

I respectfully disagree. It's not a right and it's not a privilege. There are things in life that I don't think I should be responsible for.....someone else's health is one of those things I shouldn't be responsible for.

Please, don't think I don't want a solution to this problem. I'm not cruel and I'm not foolish enough to think that every person out there is capable of fending for themselves. I don't want peoples life savings depleted because of a bad turn of events......I want to help them just like you do. I just don't think more government intrusion is the solution. There are better solutions out there.

Originally Posted by riooso

I read about all the problems with health care and I hope to God that someone will start doing something with some sanity involved. For well over 20 years the American people have wanted tort reform, a sane border policy and medical care solutions. I live in California, we are going broke. California can't even sell bonds anymore. I live in the US and we are going broke. The US dollar is going to collapse if we don't stop spending the amount of money that we are spending with no intention of paying it back. Does any sane person believe that if the US dollar does collapse that there will not be global starvation? This is not a Dem. versus Republican issue. They have both been in power yet they refuse to gitter done because they are power hungry, greedy people that lose their way once they get to Washington. Sane people have got to sit down and get this done and we don't have to become a Nazi or Communist nation to accomplish this.


Take Care,
Richard

US going broke - Collapse of the dollar. Yep, I'm one of those that believes some in power want it that way for very specific reasons and it's very deliberate rather than being one huge "D'uh....OOOPS!", one reason being a global currency. But I digress....

Chris L

Originally Posted by ChrisL

US going broke - Collapse of the dollar. Yep, I'm one of those that believes some in power want it that way for very specific reasons and it's very deliberate rather than being one huge "D'uh....OOOPS!", one reason being a global currency. But I digress....

Chris L

Yep.......

Originally Posted by riooso

I read about all the problems with health care and I hope to God that someone will start doing something with some sanity involved. For well over 20 years the American people have wanted tort reform, a sane border policy and medical care solutions. I live in California, we are going broke. California can't even sell bonds anymore. I live in the US and we are going broke. The US dollar is going to collapse if we don't stop spending the amount of money that we are spending with no intention of paying it back. Does any sane person believe that if the US dollar does collapse that there will not be global starvation? This is not a Dem. versus Republican issue. They have both been in power yet they refuse to gitter done because they are power hungry, greedy people that lose their way once they get to Washington. Sane people have got to sit down and get this done and we don't have to become a Nazi or Communist nation to accomplish this.


Take Care,
Richard

And yep....

The win-win solution is to create jobs not throw money at non sustainable programs and paybacks that get them elected. Jobs hire people, give them health care. Employed people pay taxes and then everyone is happy. Problem solved. If congress, both parties, did their jobs and not suck the life out of the people who pay for their health care and lavish trips, we would have real change not lip service.
We fight, they laugh at the voters and offer the same old empty promises that have historically ruined empires. The best government programs are lean mean with balanced budgets. If they can't pay for their big ideas with our money, they need to come up with new ones.