Thread: Fathers' Rights in Child Custody and High Conflict Divorce

Though I'm still dealing with some of the financial issues surrounding my divorce, I am largely satisfied with how the custody issue ended up (I've got primary custody in a joint custody arrangement and pay no child support because of that). Lucky for me, a combination of laziness, disinterest in parenting, arrogance, and a steady regimen of weed, vicodin, and Miller High Life kept my ex from putting up a coherent fight in family court. When she finally did put up a fight, she was already in contempt of court and had pissed off the judge. My only complaint is that it took her over 18 months to finally screw up enough to lose primary. Many men don't luck out the way I have, though. Family courts that treat fathers' parental rights with the same weight as mothers rights are the exception and not the rule.

During the course of my divorce and through the custody negotiations I did a lot of reading up on the issues facing fathers in the family court system. Numerous studies have demonstrated the importance of the father's presence in early childhood (and through adolescence, as well), yet the presumptive custodial arrangement is full custody granted to the mother and visitation to the father. I found a really good lobbying organization that actively pursues family court reform, and they have a lot of really good resources for men (and women, too) who've been shaken down by the system. A quick perusal of their web page will give you enough of an idea of the magnitude of troubles facing most single fathers.

While I had a lot of luck and a very fair judge on my side, most men can count on neither. It doesn't matter who you are or who your wife/co-parent is, there is some advice you need to hear before you become embroiled in a custody case. Don't get me wrong, there are cases where people break up amicably and place the best interests of their children first. Not all women are out to ruin their ex financially. But if you are divorcing a woman who you once loved dearly, chances are that the qualities which you loved are no longer present, and many new 'qualities' have emerged to take their place. There is a lot of advice that I wish I had gotten before my breakup, so I'm starting this thread to give you the benefit of my experience. Please read it, regardless of how well you currently get along with your partner. The worst that will come of it is that you get advice you never need.

It is critical to remember that the best way to get out of trouble with the family court system is to never get into trouble in the first place. Once child support, alimony, or (god forbid) protective orders have been established it becomes almost impossible to undo it. Here are some guidelines to do just that.


Hire a lawer. Do this ASAP. Call around and talk to a few, talk to your friends and get some recommendations. You want a calm lawyer, not an easily wound-up lawyer. You don't want one who says "We must FIGHT this injustice!", you want one who says "Here's the best you can expect". I once asked my lawyer a question early on in the divorce and after he answered I said "yeah, that's kinda' what I figured". He said "Yeah Joe, it's not like I know a hell of a lot more than you regarding this stuff, the difference between you and I is that I'm not emotionally involved in the outcome."

This is the most important thing to remember. It doesn't matter what's 'just' and 'unjust' to you or anybody, what matters is what will happen in court, and what happens in court has nothing to do with justice. A person without an emotional investment in the case will make logical decisions, and that's the best thing to have on your side. You hire a lawyer to represent you in court dispassionately. You don't hire him to be pissed off for you. You'll find that you can do that just fine on your own.


Hire a therapist. Lawyers are too expensive to waste their time talking about your feelings of betrayal. In fact, he doesn't actually want to hear that at all. At $200 an hour, you're wasting his time and your money. Spend your money talking to someone who is good at listening to people's problems and good at guiding them through the difficult times of their lives. You don't have to be crazy or wuss to benefit from therapy.


Watch your back. You may have only recently discovered that your soon-to-be-ex is a sociopath. Once you discover it, don't forget it. If her actions have demonstrated that she can't be trusted, then you must take every precaution to protect yourself. Never be alone with her, never give her access to where you are living. Never take her word on anything that can't be independently verified. My ex hid assets (my assets) from me during the divorce. She also tried to draw me into a fight while secretly videotaping me. Which leads me to my next bit of advice


Stay Calm!. Manipulative people are generally able to get you to make mistakes by getting you in a state of emotional arousal. Pissing you off is easy enough, and angry people do things they will later regret. It's easy enough for a woman to get a protective order against you by simply claiming that you are a threat. It will be incumbent upon you to prove that you aren't. Whatever you do, don't give her any ammunition. Yelling is abuse, to the courts. I don't even have to mention that physical violence is enough to cost you all of your parental rights and much of your future earnings. Don't even punch a wall (that is considered intimidation, another form of abuse). Remove yourself from the situation as soon as possible. Arrange that all your contacts with her be in a public place, If you are in the house with her, never let her come between you and the door. This last one is very serious. I'll say it again; Never let her get between you and the door!


Document everything. Keep a diary and write down every exchange that you have with your STBX. Make a note in there every day. State what happened between the two of you, what sort of contact you had with the kids, anything notable about them (dirty clothes, missing school, getting dropped off late and hungry, EVERYTHING). Don't trust your memory, it sucks. All communications with your ex should be written/email. Don't go by her word on anything, have a paper/email trail. If she says "I wanted drop the kids off/pick the kids up early/late..." tell her Send me an email/text.


If anyone else has advice or experiences they wish to share, please do. It's a subject that most people don't like to bring up, but I think it's an important one to get out in the open.

Amen brother!!

hmmmmmmmmmmmm .... where the hell were you 10 years ago?

Sound advice Joe. Sure wish i could have / should have / would have ... well you know!

Thanks for all the others going behind me

Best Regards, and actually congratulations on keeping your kids bud!

Mike

Hey Joe, please don't take this the wrong way but I am curious: If you look back now, do you think you should not have married her, judging only by the things you knew / saw at the time of the wedding?

The reason I ask is that among friends and colleagues who divorce, an often heard theme is that people assumed that their partner would change, or that marriage would make things better. Too often I hear that people didn't talk about the important things in life (yes or no to career, kids, adventure, etc) or assume that the partner will change their mind once they are married.

Originally Posted by Mcbladescar

hmmmmmmmmmmmm .... where the hell were you 10 years ago?

Hmmmm... 10 yeas ago I was getting into this mess.

Originally Posted by Mcbladescar

Sound advice Joe. Sure wish i could have / should have / would have ... well you know!

Here's the trouble with this kind of advice; No one gets married thinking that they're going to get in a divorce. Even when you suspect there might be trouble, the idea of preparing yourself emotionally or legally feels like you're betraying someone to whom you promised your eternal love. It feels like cheating. I know I didn't want to seek out the right kind of advice when things started going south, but I know I would have benefitted from it.

Originally Posted by Mcbladescar

Thanks for all the others going behind me

Best Regards, and actually congratulations on keeping your kids bud!

Mike

Just the one kid, but thanks.

And I hope that someone can benefit from my experience.

Originally Posted by Bruno

Hey Joe, please don't take this the wrong way but I am curious: If you look back now, do you think you should not have married her, judging only by the things you knew / saw at the time of the wedding?

The reason I ask is that among friends and colleagues who divorce, an often heard theme is that people assumed that their partner would change, or that marriage would make things better. Too often I hear that people didn't talk about the important things in life (yes or no to career, kids, adventure, etc) or assume that the partner will change their mind once they are married.

That's a very good question and there's actually a few different answers. On the one hand, I knew that there were some troubles before I got married. In that regard, I suppose I should have taken things more seriously than I did.

On the other hand, many of the issues were issues of magnitude. For example, she occasionally smoked weed and spent money foolishly (shopping jag now and then, for which she seemed to feel badly about). After the ink was dry on the marriage certificate it became apparent that she had only been controlling herself because she felt she had to. Her behavior went off the deep end once she got the ring. What had been merely annoying (below the threshold of unacceptability) suddenly came to the fore as a very large issue (issues, actually)

So the definitive answer is yes and no. The things that led to the break up was not that I expected her to change after the marriage, but that I expected her to not get worse as soon as the wedding was done. They were all issues that were there before the wedding, but to a smaller degree (and there were a some other behaviors that are too much to go into unless you have the patience and time to read a small book). She changed, but it wasn't really a change, if you know what I mean.

Does that make any sense?

I too have been there. It was a long, expensive divorce. However, I was able to get custody of my children and raised them to be productive adults. My son is 28 and my daughter is 22, they were 9 and 3 when I got custody of them. I never recieved one penny of child support and had to raise them with the help of family and friends. Looking back I would not change making the decision to fight for them for any amount of money in the world. I adopted my son when he was 6 and got custody of him 3 years later. I dread thinking of the living hell his life would have become had I not adopted him and fought for him. Thanks for raising everyone's awareness.

Originally Posted by joesixpack

That's a very good question and there's actually a few different answers. On the one hand, I knew that there were some troubles before I got married. In that regard, I suppose I should have taken things more seriously than I did.

On the other hand, many of the issues were issues of magnitude. For example, she occasionally smoked weed and spent money foolishly (shopping jag now and then, for which she seemed to feel badly about). After the ink was dry on the marriage certificate it became apparent that she had only been controlling herself because she felt she had to. Her behavior went off the deep end once she got the ring. What had been merely annoying (below the threshold of acceptability) suddenly came to the fore as a very large issue (issues, actually)

So the definitive answer is yes and no. The things that led to the break up was not that I expected her to change after the marriage, but that I expected her to not get worse as soon as the wedding was done. They were all issues that were there before the wedding, but to a smaller degree (and there were a some other behaviors that are too much to go into unless you have the patience and time to read a small book). She changed, but it wasn't really a change, if you know what I mean.

Does that make any sense?

I think I understand what you mean. That is one of the 2 big marriage mistakes that usually lie at the source of a divorce.
The other common mistake is that people go into marriage with the wrong expectations. That is why I think the traditional marriage vows are important, and why they are the way they are for a reason.

Love and cherish (e.g. sex will stay on the menu), in good times and bad (shit will happen), for richer and poorer (you may lose your job, or house, or whatever), in sickness and (one of you may need continuous care eventually) in health, till death (there is no plan B) do you part. Too many people go into marriage thinking that everything will be rainbows and flying unicorns for the rest of their life. The traditional vows are the way they are precisely because marriage can be challenging. Consequently, many times, one of the partners bails out as soon as they're having problems.

Anyway, sorry for going slightly off topic.

Good advice.

I made a point of hiring a female lawyer, one well-experienced in family issues. In my case, it was my wife who changed, and changed radically, because of prescription drug addiction. There is something about a female lawyer standing by your side supporting what you say that is very appealing to the judge. Of course I had a very good case, but sometimes that is not enough.