Thread: Pondering......

Originally Posted by earcutter

Seriously man! It doesn't work for the very reason you stated - greed!! And greed is a Universal truth! So be done with it!!

Again you come from a county that HAS embraced socialist ideals! Not once were you even close to being Communist! Not even CLOSE. You would have had to kill off the Queen first!

Seriously - read up on the difference man!

Sorry but having studied econ as much as I have this kind of leap drives me nuts!

I never said the UK was communist ... but communism is extreme socialism or as Marx said "higher socialism". I understand the difference I assure you. I want society to be communist (hence it's ok to call me commie), my country was socialist.

We would not have to kill the Queen, politics has little to do with the Queen in the UK, she is symbolic.

Originally Posted by straightrazorheaven

I never said the UK was communist ... but communism is extreme socialism or as Marx said "higher socialism". I understand the difference I assure you. I want society to be communist, my country was socialist.

Is capitalism not a way of understanding the human condition for the betterment of all? How many have been pulled out of poverty in the last ten yeas alone - because of capitalism?! When did any communist country ever lay claim to that?

The answer is more than in recorded history!! And Never!

Originally Posted by earcutter

Is capitalism not a way of understanding the human condition for the betterment of all? How many have been pulled out of poverty in the last ten yeas alone - because of capitalism?! When did any communist country ever lay claim to that?

I disagree, I feel that capitalism is a way of understanding the human condition so it can be exploited. These new "right to work" laws are capitalistic (new word made up here you saw it first lol). They empower the corporations against the civilians. You are right some people have been pulled out of poverty, what about the many more that are emerging into poverty because of a lack of jobs.

Nobody has an excuse to be in poverty in England. You can be poor, but you will never need for anything. The only people who will need are those who can't follow the rules. There is, for example, free housing for the homeless ... providing they stay drug free. If they can't stay drug free (and believe me there is TONS of help) on the streets they go.

Just read an official definition:

"Capitalism is an economic system that is based on private ownership of the means of production and the production of goods or services for profit"

That says it all really.

Originally Posted by straightrazorheaven

I disagree, I feel that capitalism is a way of understanding the human condition so it can be exploited. These new "right to work" laws are capitalistic (new word made up here you saw it first lol). They empower the corporations against the civilians. You are right some people have been pulled out of poverty, what about the many more that are emerging into poverty because of a lack of jobs.

Nobody has an excuse to be in poverty in England. You can be poor, but you will never need for anything. The only people who will need are those who can't follow the rules. There is, for example, free housing for the homeless ... providing they stay drug free. If they can't stay drug free (and believe me there is TONS of help) on the streets they go.

LOL - well - sorry - I got excited. It's clear you don't know the numbers. I answered it in my post in an edit.

I am glad you feel for your fellow human - but your way of caring is a bit different than mine, and that's cool.

The answer as to why I think you are way off in left field is because I know you don't know the facts and you are seemingly ok with that. Moreover, you are ok or think all should "follow the rules" - tools! And then you too can live in relative squalor but want for nothing.

We all play by the rules brother... some systems however, allow you to be more innovate than others - I don't want to live in one that seeks the death of my creativity and intellect for the many... is all. YMMV.

Originally Posted by earcutter

LOL - well - sorry - I got excited. It's clear you don't know the numbers. I answered it in my post in an edit.

I am glad you feel for your fellow human - but your way of caring is a bit different than mine, and that's cool.

The answer as to why I think you are way off in left field is because I know you don't know the facts and you are seemingly ok with that. Moreover, you are ok or think all should "follow the rules" - tools! And then you too can live in relative squalor but want for nothing.

We all play by the rules brother... some systems however, allow you to be more innovate than others - I don't want to live in one that seeks the death of my creativity and intellect for the many... is all. YMMV.

All I can add is:
"Who is John Galt?"

Originally Posted by earcutter

LOL - well - sorry - I got excited. It's clear you don't know the numbers. I answered it in my post in an edit.

I am glad you feel for your fellow human - but your way of caring is a bit different than mine, and that's cool.

The answer as to why I think you are way off in left field is because I know you don't know the facts and you are seemingly ok with that. Moreover, you are ok or think all should "follow the rules" - tools! And then you too can live in relative squalor but want for nothing.

We all play by the rules brother... some systems however, allow you to be more innovate than others - I don't want to live in one that seeks the death of my creativity and intellect for the many... is all. YMMV.

Well, since one of the only exports from the UK is intelligence ... I think socialism may foster innovation, and thinking more than most societies . The UK is socialist to a great extent, capitalism is still fostered there too. The two political methodologies work well together.
Not everyone plays by the rules, I wish they would. I don't want communism as it is today, I want it like it was meant to be. Jesus, I bet the feds are on their way over "PUT YOUR HANDS UP AND KICK OVER YOUR GREENCARD" lol.

Originally Posted by scap99

All I can add is:
"Who is John Galt?"

NICE lol!

For those who don't know - "As the plot unfolds, Galt is acknowledged to be a creator, philosopher, and inventor who symbolizes the power and glory of the human mind. He serves as a principled counterpoint to the collectivist social and economic structure depicted in the novel. The depiction portrays a society based on oppressive bureaucratic functionaries and a culture that embraces stifling mediocrity and egalitarianism, which the novel associates with socialistic idealism."

Originally Posted by straightrazorheaven

Well, since one of the only exports from the UK is intelligence ... I think socialism may foster innovation, and thinking more than most societies . The UK is socialist to a great extent, capitalism is still fostered there too. The two political methodologies work well together.
Not everyone plays by the rules, I wish they would. I don't want communism as it is today, I want it like it was meant to be. Jesus, I bet the feds are on their way over "PUT YOUR HANDS UP AND KICK OVER YOUR GREENCARD" lol.

Well now you are back to socialism - and I too come from a country that embraces a bit more than that of some. But don't ever fool yourself - have a look at your banks brother:

Top Banks in the World

Great Britain exports a whole lot oh capitalism itself - other than intellectual property lol.

Oh and congrats on your Green Card! That tells me you come from some affluence. Am I wrong?

Originally Posted by earcutter

NICE lol!

For those who don't know - "As the plot unfolds, Galt is acknowledged to be a creator, philosopher, and inventor who symbolizes the power and glory of the human mind. He serves as a principled counterpoint to the collectivist social and economic structure depicted in the novel. The depiction portrays a society based on oppressive bureaucratic functionaries and a culture that embraces stifling mediocrity and egalitarianism, which the novel associates with socialistic idealism."



Well now you are back to socialism - and I too come from a country that embraces a bit more of that than some as well. But don't ever fool yourself - have a look at your banks brother:

Top Banks in the World

Great Britain exports a whole lot oh capitalism itself - other than intellectual property lol.

Oh and congrats on your Green Card! That tells me you come from some affluence. Am I wrong?

Oh Hell I understand they do a lot of the old dirty stuff. From my years at university I have come to understand how much is exported in the form of research. UK needs to have a little more industry but that's tough without having full blown capitalism because the country is too restrictive for most corporations.