Thread: Best Stainless for Razors ?

Originally Posted by Bruno

I don't know about the others, but I have used niolox (SB-1) as razor steel. You can get it from Achim in Germany

Is it good stuff? Does it need special HT? I have seen that SB-1 can be bought in 6,5mm thickness, and can have high hardness with a fine grain structure, sound like a good candidate for a razor.

Ok, this may be controversial, but I will yes and no.
Yes, if you want to max out on a specific hardness, it needs special HT. Special, as in more difficult than carbon steel.
However, I HT it like normal carbon steel, but a bit hotter. And I get consistent 59.5 HRC as verified by Mike Blue, with a very fine grain structure.
So I say no, if 59.5 is high enough for you.

And as you say, it can be bought in 6.5 mm which makes it ideal for making razors.

Originally Posted by Mike Blue

I really really wish Hitachi would publish simple data sheets like Crucible and so many others.

Yeah but if they do that, how are they going to be able to claim their new and improved wonder steel is so much better than the obsolete last year's wonder steel, when the differences are so small they might as well be homeopathic?

There's a few makers in America using it and here in south africa i can get what is sold as 14c28n in up 3.2 and 4mm... there are rumours about provenance... but some people get it to behave as it should...

P.s. bestar makes their own steel with niobium called be-cut... and that is available in single sheets and a variety of thicknesses. It is not the same as niolox, but knowing bestar it would be quite good. Niobium inhibits grain growth during overheating and i think might make for smaller carbides in the process. Not sure about this though.

I have found niolox to be EXTREMELY good at inhibiting grain growth during overheating.
I have broken several blades quenched at different temperatures just for the sake of establishing just how easy it is to heat treat.
Most people here tell me I need a vacuum oven or salt baths to HT niolox, but when I did some experiments, I found I could consistently HT it to 59.5 even when quenching at higher temperatures and long soak times.
In every blade I broke, the grain was so fine you couldn't see it

Becut has more niobium and less carbon... if you quench it faster i suspect it will get harder than bestar sheets... only reason for concern with all these are retained austinite after overheating and no subzero quenching. That messes with fine edge stability. I would sub zero even if i austinized at lower temps...

Originally Posted by Mike Blue

I don't mind a discussion. Just so we are both on the same page, show me the reference materials you are using, please.

Here's mine: http://www.crucible.com/PDFs//DataSh...54cmv12010.pdf It is of some interest that Crucible neglects to mention minor alloying elements like vanadium and tungsten.

Well, crucible never returned my email, but the maker behind zKnives did, and he sourced Niagra Specialty Metals, (a cpm distributer) as his source, as they state a 0.4% "Max" of both elements in 154cm (cpm or other).
Niagara Specialty Metals: Knife Steels
He also states that he will update the app to reflect that it is a "Max" threshold, not necessarily a requirement. He also noted that when he inquired about it they told him it was unintentional trace amounts present, but some knife makers believe it is intentionally left out of the details because it makes the steel harder to machine.

Fwiw.

0.4% is actually quite a lot. 0.4% of tungsten and vanadium each, would have a noticeable impact on the abrasion resistance of the steel when machineing it.

That's what I said, considering the alloy elements in different steel often vary in fractions of percentages, adding 0.4% of 2 different elements vs. Zero all but makes a completely different alloy...

My guess would be, as an official Crucible distributer, that Niagra Specialty has their own spectrometer, and detected the elements present at least in certain batches (leading to the "0.4% Max" designation), before posting it on their website in contrast to Crucible's own posted official data sheets? Idk for certain, but just weird for such a discrepancy...