Thread: Expert Advise Required

Hi, is there any thing I can do to correct this.
I've used a Sharpie on the bevel.
On my Shaptons the blade is flat and the ink is instantly removed.
However on my Jnats the blade isn't flat and the ink remains.
I have lapped everything back to square one , so my stones are ok.
Thank you.

As long as your stones are flat, they should remove the markings equally regardless of stone used..
With different speeds of course, depending on medium.
I'd say it could be you are using more pressure on your Shapton's than on your Japanese natural?

Anyways, go back and reset the bevel properly, making sure once it is done, the markings are uniformly removed all across the bevel.
That should be the trick as far as I can tell from the pics.
If there are grind issues on the razor that prevents you from getting all the markings off, then at least make sure you remove enough o have the apex of the edge clean and honed on both sides.

Originally Posted by Birnando

As long as your stones are flat, they should remove the markings equally regardless of stone used..
With different speeds of course, depending on medium.
I'd say it could be you are using more pressure on your Shapton's than on your Japanese natural?

Anyways, go back and reset the bevel properly, making sure once it is done, the markings are uniformly removed all across the bevel.
That should be the trick as far as I can tell from the pics.
If there are grind issues on the razor that prevents you from getting all the markings off, then at least make sure you remove enough o have the apex of the edge clean and honed on both sides.

You hit the nail on the head with the pressure theory .
I never thought of that.
I noticed parts of the blade going hazy off the jnats and the middle part (inked) remaining mirror finished.
I have tried and tried on the 1k Shapton to even it out but it wont happen.
Can you elaborate a little on this quote please

""If there are grind issues on the razor that prevents you from getting all the markings off, then at least make sure you remove enough o have the apex of the edge clean and honed on both sides"""

Thanks a lot for the help

Originally Posted by JOB15

You hit the nail on the head with the pressure theory .
I never thought of that.
I noticed parts of the blade going hazy off the jnats and the middle part (inked) remaining mirror finished.
I have tried and tried on the 1k Shapton to even it out but it wont happen.
Can you elaborate a little on this quote please

""If there are grind issues on the razor that prevents you from getting all the markings off, then at least make sure you remove enough o have the apex of the edge clean and honed on both sides"""

Thanks a lot for the help

What I mean by that is that it is very common for the grinding of the hollowing on each side to not be 100% even.
In your case it could be that there are fractionally more material removed in the centre of the blade than on the heel and tip area.
No biigie really, you just need to make sure that you are removing material at the entire length of the apex of the edge before you can move up in progression from the initial bevel-set.
That way you'll have an edge that will shave well, regardless of what the sides of the bevel looks like.

Originally Posted by Birnando

What I mean by that is that it is very common for the grinding of the hollowing on each side to not be 100% even.
In your case it could be that there are fractionally more material removed in the centre of the blade than on the heel and tip area.
No biigie really, you just need to make sure that you are removing material at the entire length of the apex of the edge before you can move up in progression from the initial bevel-set.
That way you'll have an edge that will shave well, regardless of what the sides of the bevel looks like.

I can take even amounts of metal up to the Jnats.
Unless I apply pressure on the jnats?
I need an all over satin jnat finish on the blade otherwise the seller has sold me a dud .

Originally Posted by JOB15

I can take even amounts of metal up to the Jnats.
Unless I apply pressure on the jnats?
I need an all over satin jnat finish on the blade otherwise the seller has sold me a dud .

No, it's a long way to a dud yet
With proper technique a hazy finish can be had on it yet.
Now, go back until you can remove all markings without the added pressure.
That means easing up on the pressure on your bevel setter after a proper setting of it.
Don't stop until it is done.
re-mark the bevel as needed.
Once there, the Jnat should be doing the same, give you a uniform haze.
If not it is simply not flat.

Are you certain that all of your hones are true? Use a pencil and mark the Jant with cross hatch pattern and then go over it with your lapping plate.

What does the other side look like?
The tape does appear a bit worn. I would replace your tape and use a finger of pressure in the middle on this side, to see if you can get the middle.

It does look like you are hitting the edge, or it could be the lighting. Inking the spine tape will quickly show you what the condition of the spine is.

If the stones are flat, it has to be a pressure issue, don’t think the razor is defective… just not perfectly straight… few are.

I've done a bit more investigating.
The Sharpie comes away from the blade on the 1k,4k,8k Shaptons but not on my 2 Jnats.
I've now realised that the only Stone that properly cuts the whole length and width of the bevel is the 1K.
The 4K will do the whole length and width of the bevel but only with extra pressure.
The 8K will remove the ink but not cut the bevel enough to make it uniform, it will only cut the very edge of the bevel.
The jnats require stupid amounts of finger pressure to remove the ink.
I'm thinking I should contact the seller, this could be my first and last custom blade.
I have the shapton lapper with pencil markings so the hones are flat.

Things I have learned after honing a few razors

1. Very few razors have perfect geometry
2. Regardless of what you think your stones/hones are not lapped perfectly flat, and probably never will be
3. The judicious use of "Honing Gymnastics" or the various strokes are what makes the imperfect bevel meet and kiss the imperfect surface of the hone..
4. Trying to "Make" the bevel "Perfect" normally results in losing much more steel then needed to make the razor a smooth shaver, sometimes chasing the bevel can make things worse
5. The ultimate goal of honing and shaving with a SR IMHO is a Close, Comfortable, Shave not a pretty even bevel. (Not that we all don't love them)


Just some realistic observations, but in the end it is your razor, and your honing, so where you take it is your
choice


Edit: A caveat here, "Within Reasonable Tolerances" I just came back after thinking about some of the recent "Custom" razors I have seen with geometry that is no where close to the accepted 16 degrees and they have huge fat uneven bevels or need stupid amounts of tape to hone... Not talking about those at all