Thread: Chinese 12k question (s)

If a person wants a natural stone then they have to live with the variations in grit size and density. That's just the nature of the beast.
Most of us have seen this in Coticules, Eschers, Tam O'Shanters, Arkansas stones and Chinese 12K etc.
The number of laps required will depend on the individual stone, the work done at the lower grits, the steel, the stroke, and your desired edge.
As usual, there is no easy answer.

You pays your money and takes your chances!
( Just working on my first cup of coffee this morning )

Originally Posted by jnich67

I'm no pro when it comes to honing, so I don't know if I should even post here...Anyway, I love my Chinese 12K. Simply put, it does what it's meant to do without all the jumping through hoops and tricks people have come up with to maximize some of the other natural stones. Sometimes I wonder if this stone doesn't have a higher standing so we can justify the $$ we've spent on the sexier stones

I use mine with water only. 80-120 laps off the 8K - badda bing! Done and ready every time (provided I've done good work at the lower grits). YMMV and all that...

I lapp it easily with 220-400 grit sandpaper and finish on 600-1000 - Whatever I have laying around.

If I had to choose one set up right now, it would be the Norton followed by the Chinese 12K and then a little chrom ox for good measure. This is subject to change of course, but for somone like me who doesn't take the time to experiment eight ways from Sunday, it's all you need.

Jordan

Emphasis added by me, but I am right there with you. Apparently, we've got comparable examples of the Chinese 12K.

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Then I started thinking that there were maybe variations on how they were used, I had heard stroke numbers from 50-300...

This is a factor rarely mentioned - The size & shape of the hone.
I always use the narrow edge of my hones on about a 4" stroke.
Someone using the full width and length of an 8" hone is likely to make less passes.

I have used mine for about two years now. It performs as it is supposed to, it polishes and it does a fantastic job. Of course this is made easier if you did your job at the lower grits. I have used it wet, dry, with slurry and I can't remember how else. I love my brick and can not see using anything else for polishing my edges. I usually do anywhere from 50 to 100 laps just because that is what works for me. I like the fact that the stone sucks the blade into it when the stone is wet. I see this as the perfect amount of pressure and all I do is guide the blade.

Raf

I have a Tupperware container in which I keep my Norton stones and my Chinese 12K submerged at all times. Works great for me. I recently used an Escher slurry stone on the 12K and it seemed to do quite well. I do 100 w/slurry and 100 no/slurry. Then 30 on the Escher. Sometimes I will also do 50 on the 16K Shapton and 100 or 200 on the Nakayama. Then strop.

I also like a procedure told to me by Russell Baldridge. It goes like this. Do the Norton pyramid, then 30 on the yellow coticule, 30 on the Escher and strop. Sometimes I will do 30 on the Blue Belgian, then 30 Yellow and 30 Escher. Basiclly I see no problem with the 12K Chinese. You might like to try using rotten stone as a slurry on the Chinese 12K. Then dilute as you hone. I will use rotten stone on Norton stones just to break the monotony. I think Bill Ellis does this also.

The longer I play with straights ( I started in 1968 ), the more I am convinced that I must keep my stones FLAT. Also, you may as well forget finish honing unless or until you have the correct bevel set on your blade. First things first....

If you have a sense of adventure, give the 12K A TRY. I hope this helps someone out there. ............ Jerry

Jerry, what the heck is a rotten stone???

Rottenstone can be found at woodworking stores. It is a powder made from decaying limestone. I have used it in the past on a paddle strop. It is very fine and breaks down with use. Maybe 1.0 micron? I put mine in a electric coffee bean grinder and powdered it first. I wanted to break up any large grains.

One of its traditional uses is to combine it with parrafin oil and use it as a final polish on wood, after varnish. Pumice is used first.

Randy gave you a very good description of rotten stone. I can add a thing or two. Rotten stone is extensively used by gunstock refinishers as a final polish for hand rubbed linseed oil finishes. It is also great for other hand rubbed oils such as birchwood oil which I prefer to linseed based finishes. I refinished gunstocks for 30 years and I was glad to find out that I can use it for razor honing because I believe I have about a lifetime supply of rotten stone and also pumice stone. Many old-fashioned hardware stores probably still sell it. JERRY

I too am no hone expert but I own quite a few this being one, I lapped mine with a Norton lapping stone drew pencil lines and repeated, entire process under 15 minutes if I remember correct. I have read where they will wear down a Norton Lapping stone although I don't know how true that is. I found it to be a good stone to learn on as it cuts so slow it is very hard to overhone I would do 10-15 laps then check edge and repeat as necessary. You can with enough patience and time in my opinion get a nice edge off it but with enough patience and practice you can get a nice edge off most hones. It is no longer one of the hones I go to too much anymore instead I prefer others but it was good when I was starting out honing due to it cutting so slow.

Thanks for the explanations. I'll have to try some. I still don't understand how limestone actually rots, but I'll go ahead and look for it anyway.

Use of the rottenstone on the Chinese hone reminds me of a thread several months ago by someone who was experimenting with using Chromium Oxide on a Chinese hone. I would assume the use of the rottenstone would have a similar effect.