Thread: Naniwa Superstone Lapping Issue

Originally Posted by niftyshaving

Try storing the hone inverted on paper or shop towels
so it drains and drys then just spray the surface.
Since you have lapped it once it is close enough to
just lap it enough to raise a slurry from now on.

I have tried wicking them dry on a towel. That had no change in the effect.

I have lapped them to fully flat dozens of times and only use a spray bottle to wet just the surface of the hones, but the same effect continues to happen over and over again. No matter how many times I lap them flat, the next time I lap them they again are higher in the middle. Maybe these are eternal hones that grow thicker with use?!?!

Guess again!

Originally Posted by janivar123

My unmounted naniwas act the same way
Also seems to me that more water i add worse it gets

Thanks for letting me know. That eliminates the possibility of it being due to a tension effect due to being attached to the base. I suspected as much given that I saw the same thing on the Shapton Professional, which is also resin based.

The reason this issue bugs me so much is that it means my lapping to keep the hone flat has nothing to do with the amount of honing I'm doing to cause wear to the hone, but instead is due simply to the swelling of the hone. This runs counter to my basic parsimonious nature. (Remember, I'm the guy who makes his soap pucks last up to seven years! That is cheap!)

I've noticed the same thing myself--my 400 & 1K lap normally & fast w/ a D8C. THe 3/8 combo would take forever probably if I drew a grid. The speckles on the 3K side almost seem to swell more than the rest of the hone--I'd swear I can feel them--this is after the hone has been wet for more than a few min.

Stop using the grid lines, I haven't drawn a grid line on any stone or hone in at least 1 year, when I get a new one I grid line it then I am done grid lining unless I sense a problem...
Take the Naniwas for one, yes they swell and contract, if you just toss them in water 1 stone before you use them they have time to stabilize...
I use the DGLP on mine too it works easier then the DMT,,,

Here is my routine, toss in the 1k SS go get a cup of coffee, come back in 10 minutes and start honing on the 1k, I toss in the 3k when I start... First thing I do on the 1k is about 5 figure 8's then hone away on a fresh clean surface, next razor 5 figure 8's and the razor is on a clean fresh hone, next razor 5 figure 8's honing again on a clean fresh hone...Repeat..
The 3k comes out of the water and the 5k goes in the water and the sequence begins again...
I never grid line a stone, I never hone on a dirty stone, I have clean, fresh, level hones continually
I don't only use this system on the Naniwas I use it on all my stones and hones but I figured it out when I bought my Naniwas as I was having the same problem as you described, and they load fast... So I started this routine and I have never had a problem again..
Oh yeah, I spin the stone 180 degrees with ever razor so they stay even... and use no pressure other than the weight of the plate to clean them off...

Hint: if you are only honing 1 razor toss in 2 hones at the same time, or hone really slow

I do that 180 degree spin of the hones, that works really well. It seems to make them go longer between lapping, thats for sure..!

I've noticed my Naniwas wear inconsistently as well, and the effect is more pronounced on the lower grit stones. I dont see this with my Shaptons though.

Well, Glen, you gave me something new to try, so that's a start.

I never bother with gridlines either. I can easily see what is and is not being cut with the lapping plate. I only drew the grids as a visual aid for lapping prior to taking the pictures. (Also, as an aside, I have to point out how great my wife is. She walked by after I had laid out all the hones and instead of pointing out that I had too many hones, though they are the tip of an iceberg, she commented on how cool they looked all in a row!)

I also do a 5 to 10 figure 8s prior to every razor to refresh the surface and to generate slurry. What you described in your experimental honing strategy thread was eerily similar to what I'd already been doing for the past year. With other hones the light surface refresh eliminates the need for lapping because the refreshing constantly keeps the surface flat, but that hasn't worked for the Naniwas. The middle region just kept getting higher.

I have never soaked the hones. I suspect that is the significant difference. Because of the warping that I found very early on, I have been diligent about keeping a uniform light layer of water sprayed on the surface to insure uniform wetting and absorption thinking that would at least reduce the problem.

I will give the soaking a try and report back!

Edit: I also do the 180 degree spin, but it is a good idea to remind others to do it! The x-stroke does not produce uniform wear on the hone, so rotating the hone makes the wear more uniform--along the same line as rotating tires.

I notice the same sort of odd wear pattern on my 3k, but it is less prevalent on my 8k. I just lap until they are uniform in color and then go about honing.

I let them soak somewhat, as I noticed that if I didn't they seemed to load faster.

According to Blaireau, a scientist in the field of polymers, Naniwas, Shapton pros and any hone with a polymer based binder will change with temperature and moisture variables. That is why I always lap either of those brands before every honing session and never before I put them away. They will change before the next session and need lapping again. That is also why the center may need more than the ends, or vice versa.

FWIW, My Shaptons, and Naniwas are the thicker stones with no base so the adhesive to base formula would not be the issue with mine. Just the composition of the binder and how it reacts to the environment.

You know, Utopian, I was hoping Glen would chime in, because I wanted him to share his system with you, It works well. I use it now myself. I too, only draw gridlines when the stone is new, after that, I do what he's been doing, and it works well. I've done a few razors for a couple guys and have gotten rave reviews...

The SS are so bloody soft, it has to be part of the problem..They're like sponges, hence the easy loading...I tried honing a knife one time using one of them, I forget which, and I actually cut into the stone....

Other than the soaking of the hones, I think my use of the Naniwas already has been quite similar to Glen's described routine. I've been doing it that way for well over a year and it has not altered the odd conformation of some of the hones.