Thread: Coticule size vs Natural combo

Hello,

I was in your same position a year and a half ago. When I bought a small coti/ bbw combo, 5-2 inch. After much research which brought me here, and seems I'm sticking around, I decided on the coticule, not the 4000/8000 combo norton.

I love my stone now, and i have no regrets, but i must warn it is a gamble. for several reasons:

1-Coticules are natural stones, variable, you may get one that does not make a nice shaving edge. Although Probably all cotis are good honing at mid to latter stages.

2- The Nature of your own coticule is know only by you, not like a consistent norton. So when you have a problem people here can only go so far to help you understand your specific stone.

3- bevel work will be slow for almost every Coticule you get in comparison.

4-for the cost you get a small/ hard to use stone. Fun but not easy to develop honing skills on like light touch, and keeping the blade in good contact.

Whereas the norton 4/8k will be consistent, common to everyone here to help, and a versatile hone for the cost.

All that said I love my coticule and wouldn't exchange. Mine appears to me to be a green harder type finisher. But my slurry stone is pink (almost redish) which i think adds cutting power when used with slurry. And i find it able in all stages of honing. But i did get a king 1000/4000 to help in the speed and consistent bevel work. If you need it to work out on your first attempt at honing i recommend the norton as well.

If i were you, my post would confuse me more as to what to do!

Good luck
Nathaniel

Nathaniel, I once took a bbw slurry stone to a yellow coticule and the slurry was purple. So in that case it seemed that the slurry was derived more from the rubbing stone than the base stone. Perhaps the same is happening with your pink slurry stone when applied to your green coticule. Best of both worlds.

I pretty much agree with what Nathaniel said. Also I have used and still every now and then play around with the BBW sides. I have five coticules, one with an unusable yellow side (because of inclusions that get disembedded), all of them have a BBW side (except my Les Latneasues hybrid, which just has two different coticule sides). BBW's vary, in my experience not as much as coticules (who, with some exceptions, also do not vary that drastically from stone to stone in my experience *NOTABLY DIFFERENT, BUT NOT DRASTICALLY*).

In my experience, they make for nice finishers on their own on a very light slurry (which, if you do enough strokes, you don't have to use a rubber for, since they release slurry automatically). But there's nothing you can do on a BBW that you cannot do on the yellow side. So for a $100 to spend on a coticule, the 50x150mm glued to slate seems like your best bet.

I assume you're talking about The Superior Shave deal. I've never dealt with Jarrod, but I've heard nothing but good things from many experienced coticule users who have and I highly doubt that he will send out any unusable coticule. Also because he gets supplied by Coticule Ardennes, who are quite passionate about their work and, as I have dealt with them, they do their job with great integrity.

You can re-establish a nice bevel with a coticule within reasonable time on a razor that already has some sort of bevel. Establishing a bevel from scratch will take hours and I don't recommend it (although I have done it). Usually, I go by the rule of thumb if I cannot establish a proper bevel within 15-20 minutes, I move to a coarser hone, since it means that a bevel has some chipping or a convex bevel which both require the grinding away of more steel at the edge. So if you plan on doing minor edge restorations, a 1000 grit or a 400/1000 grit hone (or something in that range) is highly recommended.

If you are on a budget you can always give lapping films a shot. You will be way under the $100 budget and will have everything you need.

Thanks again for the input. As I knew from the beginning, there is no right or wrong answer; YMMV. My first inclination was to go the 4/8K Norton rout. But I like to consider many different options before committing myself, which creates some difficulties at times, but most of the time it helps me be wiser in decision making, leading to less costly mistakes in purchases.

Originally Posted by ItalianJoe

If you are on a budget you can always give lapping films a shot. You will be way under the $100 budget and will have everything you need.

I had read quite a bit about lapping films as well. And if I do end up getting a coticule, and it doesn't quite cut it (pun intended), then lapping films may be a way to salvage the situation cheaply, and I would still have the coticule for finishing; it seems, many like the smooth edge they get using it as a finisher w/ water.

much to consider; maybe too much.

Bob,

In all honestly, It seems you've already made up your mind, and are looking for reinforcement. I could be wrong. (I've been known to be wrong before) I don't know why this is, but Coticules seem to have some kind of draw, especially to new guys. (me included) Most of the older, experienced members will tell you, buy a Norton 4/8 first. That's good advice. They are much easier to learn than a natural out of the gate, especially a Coticule, too many variables and different types. Nortons are equally fun to use by the way.

Once you have a good grasp on how to refresh/hone a blade, then move on to your naturals. Coticules can be fun to use, but there is a learning curve, regardless of what you hear. It's rare someone get's a Coticule for the first time, and can take a blade from bevel to finish. At the very least, by an old junker razor to practice with. Some blades don't respond well at all, especially bevel setting and each Coticule is different. Most people I know that use them religously go through several Coticules before they find one they really like, and can use.

These days, I use a Chosera 1k for bevel setting, A Norton 4/8 combo hone, and I finish with an Escher.

Best of luck to you and happy honing.

Rich

P.S. If you get a Coticule, don't buy anything smaller than a 6x2 or 150x50