Thread: Y/G Escher is as fine as...

The day I started using a scope,was the day honeing lost it's fun factor

Originally Posted by Wolfpack34

1+++...I agree completely Zib! I've always thought that a microscope was a redundant piece of equipment...Just IMHO! I wonder how the SR shavers and Barbers from the last few hundred years ever managed to get along without them...

We do not know what kinds of edges did the old barbers achieve with the stones available, chances are they were good edges but not quite like what we are talking about on this forum today. If I understand the history of SRP, in the beginning there was the Norton 4/8k, not this is considered a stepping stone to finer edges.
A scope can be useful tool, for me for example visual inspection of the edge tells me all I need to know about it. To each his own.

Originally Posted by mainaman

We do not know what kinds of edges did the old barbers achieve with the stones available, chances are they were good edges but not quite like what we are talking about on this forum today. If I understand the history of SRP, in the beginning there was the Norton 4/8k, not this is considered a stepping stone to finer edges.
A scope can be useful tool, for me for example visual inspection of the edge tells me all I need to know about it. To each his own.

I theorize that the pro barbers of bygone days did not want 'scary sharp' edges. They wanted a smooth and comfortable edge that was unlikely to nick a customer. As much as I like the edges I get from my eschers, I believe the edges obtained (by me) on a coticule approximate the aforementioned ideal barber's edge. Edges that are HHT 5 or whatever the current state of that art might be were probably the last thing in the world they would have wanted, shaving someone else's face one after another.

As far as magnification, I check them at the start for chips or other anomalies. I may check at some point during the honing, or after I think I'm done ..... or I might not. I found my honing improved when I went from 100x to 30 and 40x ......

Originally Posted by mainaman

Jimmy you are correct, I think in terms of refining the scratch pattern more than feeling, but in the end feeling is what counts.

+1...I agree with you Stefan..."in the end feeling is what counts"!

Stefan,for pros like you,the scope can be a great tool,Now you have honed alot of my blades.I look at every one you send me under an 80 power scope,your edges are my benchmarks,something I strive to replicate from a visual.
I have been shaving with straights for almost 20 years,back in the not to distant past I had old guys that worked at williams cutlery that could hone,Cheap,but they are all dead so I am having to learn this frustrating, seemingly impossible task,i have been at it for two years, some days are diamonds,some days are dirt I have all the proper stones,I have read everything to be read,I have seen all the videos, i have worked my butt off.
I have been honing for only two years,when i look thru the scope at my edges,I get tottaly pissed most of the time,but every once in a blue moon I can make a perfect edge happen Why I have no clue.
Scope for Me, A novice is not a good tool I think,I see far to many things in an edge I than try to correct,than the entire edge falls apart in ten strokes. Am 64 yrs old,My intention is to live to 87,If I do not learn this art by than,i will kill myself

Originally Posted by JimmyHAD

As far as magnification, I check them at the start for chips or other anomalies. I may check at some point during the honing, or after I think I'm done ..... or I might not. I found my honing improved when I went from 100x to 30 and 40x ......

I do the same check after each stage to make sure the edge looks fine e.g there is no microchips , then move on. For me 30x works perfect.

Originally Posted by pixelfixed

Stefan,for pros like you,the scope can be a great tool,Now you have honed alot of my blades.I look at every one you send me under an 80 power scope,your edges are my benchmarks,something I strive to replicate from a visual.
I have been shaving with straights for almost 20 years,back in the not to distant past I had old guys that worked at williams cutlery that could hone,Cheap,but they are all dead so I am having to learn this frustrating, seemingly impossible task,i have been at it for two years, some days are diamonds,some days are dirt I have all the proper stones,I have read everything to be read,I have seen all the videos, i have worked my butt off.
I have been honing for only two years,when i look thru the scope at my edges,I get tottaly pissed most of the time,but every once in a blue moon I can make a perfect edge happen Why I have no clue.
Scope for Me, A novice is not a good tool I think,I see far to many things in an edge I than try to correct,than the entire edge falls apart in ten strokes. Am 64 yrs old,My intention is to live to 87,If I do not learn this art by than,i will kill myself

I think that is part of the fun...the learning.
If I ever learn it all I will probably quit honing.
I agree though...sometimes it gets quite frustrating.
Stingray

Originally Posted by mainaman

I do the same check after each stage to make sure the edge looks fine e.g there is no microchips , then move on. For me 30x works perfect.

+1...I've never felt like I've ever had the need to use more than a 30x jewelers loupe to determine a course of action and to periodically check the progress.

Originally Posted by Wolfpack34

+1...I've never felt like I've ever had the need to use more than a 30x jewelers loupe to determine a course of action and to periodically check the progress.

Those high and super high magnifications are interesting to look at but for rubber meets the road honing, I agree that my 30x jeweler's loupe is a very efficient tool. More helpful within the honing progression than super high scopes. OTOH, I'm not interested in simonizing the edge. I just want a good shave.

I have a microscope I use on occasion if I get a recalcitrant razor, but other than that it sits around doing not a lot. I personally do not see the need to check for microchips along the way, only at the end and only then if the shave test tells me something is up.

I know at least one retired barber who used a coti on all his old cut throats. I imagine they were very workman like edges that straddled the boundary between customer comfort and barber effort. They were businessmen after all.

James.