Thread: Frustrated with a capital I

Guys, I'm looking for some ideas as to what might be going wrong. I noticed a week ago that my Dovo (Bismarck blade - 6/8) was getting reluctant to shave, especially ATG. Slow, jerky, and plain not cutting the hair off. So I broke out my Naniwas and did a touch up. Didn't really help. So yesterday I did a serious pyramid. Started with 5K/8K 25/20/15/10/5/3/1-3/1-5. Then a pyramid between the 8K and 12K. Then lots of stropping. And it's perhaps a bit better but still not great. Did a normal shave and easily felt whisker ATG. Got out my Ralf Aust 5/8 and it all cut off smoothly. I lapped the stones beforehand so they were nice and flat.

I'm kind of at a loss. I guess it might possibly, conceivably need a back to basics bevel setting but it's such a new blade (this is the first I've needed to sharpen it) that it seems unlikely. Probably more likely is I'm just not doing the honing correctly.

One odd thing I noticed is that when pushing the blade away from me there was a nice body of water/swarf piling up in front but when I pulled it toward myself it was way less pronounced. Maybe some tiny warping of the blade? When I put my finger on the blade as I pulled I got a much more uniform pooling.

Anyway, that's the state of play and I'd love to hear opinions as to what I might be screwing up at. Oh, one more thing, it doesn't do well AT ALL with a HHT. No pop, no snip. Clearly that's not such a great sign but that's the way it is.

TIA
Crowden

I have a theory. You convexed the bevel while stropping. More specifically, I think you convexed it when stropping away from you, which corresponds to the lack of the razor undercutting the water when you're honing towards yourself.

The solution, as you already pointed out, is a complete bevel reset. To avoid false positives, I advice to dull the edge on glass. (You might want to cut some papers before you do, it's fun I sometimes do, just to be amazed at how sharp our face-fungus removers are.)

Originally Posted by Laurens

I have a theory. You convexed the bevel while stropping. More specifically, I think you convexed it when stropping away from you, which corresponds to the lack of the razor undercutting the water when you're honing towards yourself.

The solution, as you already pointed out, is a complete bevel reset. To avoid false positives, I advice to dull the edge on glass. (You might want to cut some papers before you do, it's fun I sometimes do, just to be amazed at how sharp our face-fungus removers are.)

I didn't realize stropping could alter a blade to that degree. I'll note that the edges of the strop are darker than the middle, leading me to believe that most of the blade contact is occurring on those edges.

Originally Posted by Headcrowny

I didn't realize stropping could alter a blade to that degree. I'll note that the edges of the strop are darker than the middle, leading me to believe that most of the blade contact is occurring on those edges.

The darkness says it all: stropping does remove a tiny amount of metal. And considering the thinness of the edge, a tiny amount is all it takes. You can confirm this with the magic marker test. If you haven't heard of it: mark the bevels with a sharpy and hone 1-3 strokes. The ink should be completely gone from the bevels, right up to the edge. I suspect there will be a thin line of ink left on the backside of the razor. You may need a loupe or some other magnification to see it clearly.

Good luck with getting it back in line!

Stropping can definitely alter a blade...still after more than a year, I pay very close attention to my stropping technique. Spine flat on the strop, properly rolling the blade without lifting it off the strop....all it take is to roll the edge of a few blades until that lesson get's painful!!

What did the edge look like under magnification before it was touched up?

First I would find out what the problem is, then the cause.

I would suspect stropping as well, but you should find out. If it is stropping then how bad the edge is damaged determines how much work the bevel needs. If the edge is damaged it is easier and better to start over and bevel set. You will still need to deal with the cause.

Are these new razors?

When a razor stops shaving you need to look at the edge and find out why. And then decide on a course of action. You have done well over a hundred laps on this razor without any effect. So now you will most probably have to re set the bevel.

Whatever the cause it will most probably happen again, stropping is often the cause.

Originally Posted by Phrank

Stropping can definitely alter a blade...still after more than a year, I pay very close attention to my stropping technique. Spine flat on the strop, properly rolling the blade without lifting it off the strop....all it take is to roll the edge of a few blades until that lesson get's painful!!

? Rolling the blade without lifting it off the strop ... That sounds ominous. I routinely lift the blade off the strop because of my dread of nicking the leather. Am I inadvertently doing myself a disservice here?

Originally Posted by Euclid440

What did the edge look like under magnification before it was touched up?

First I would find out what the problem is, then the cause.

I would suspect stropping as well, but you should find out. If it is stropping then how bad the edge is damaged determines how much work the bevel needs. If the edge is damaged it is easier and better to start over and bevel set. You will still need to deal with the cause.

Are these new razors?

When a razor stops shaving you need to look at the edge and find out why. And then decide on a course of action. You have done well over a hundred laps on this razor without any effect. So now you will most probably have to re set the bevel.

Whatever the cause it will most probably happen again, stropping is often the cause.

Yes, both new razors and both expertly sharpened (not by me) before use. I'm the only culprit in the desharpifying. Since I didn't look at the blade under a loupe beforehand, I can't comment on that. But I can look now and also do the sharpie test.

Originally Posted by Headcrowny

? Rolling the blade without lifting it off the strop ... That sounds ominous. I routinely lift the blade off the strop because of my dread of nicking the leather. Am I inadvertently doing myself a disservice here?

The magic roll: it's a bit hard to put into words, but let me try. Start rolling just before you stop sliding and start sliding just before you stop rolling and the edge touches the strop. Once you get that feeling, you cannot nick the strop, because the edge is always moving away from the leather and never pauses (or reverses) on it.

If you have a loupe I would recommend a sharpie test and close inspection of the edge in good light. This can reveal a rolled edge or a convex bevel. They are pretty cheap on amazon. Usually between $2 to $10 depending on specs.

There are more expensive ones, bit I think it is overkill. YMMV