Thread: Getting my Bismarck to pass the Hanging Hair Test

It would be super helpful if someone knowledgeable made a video about honing a shoulder-less razor like the Bismarck, from bevel setting all the way to finishing. There seem to be ton of videos on straight razors that have shoulders.

One day, I would make one myself when I become good at it.

Originally Posted by Euclid440

First you must determine if the bevels are set, coming togeather evenly all the way across the edge.

Here

Here is a simple, 100 percent effective test. If you see shinny spots, those spots are where the bevels are NOT meeting. The edge should be a grey blur under magnification, shinny is not good. Make sure the stabilizer is not hitting the hone and holding the edge off the stone. Put marker ink on the stabilizer.

Once you have, for sure set the bevel, do 10 more lite laps on the 1K then move up to the next stone.

If the bevel is not set and you think you are not making full contact, use the magic marker test. Ink the bevels with a marker use colored ink, red is good. Check to see if ALL the ink is removed all the way to the edge, if not do another lap. If not remove in 3-4 laps you have a problem, find out why.

Sounds like your blade may be warped a bit and not making full contact. Use ink to monitor your progress. Downward pressure, will cause more problems, later in the progression with micro chipping.

You do not have to remove a 1/8th inch from the 4/8K, just make sure it is flat and smooth.

What are you using to lap your stones?

Once the bevel is set it is just a matter of removing the stria completely from the previous stone. Do not move up until the stria is removed, alternate the stria pattern by using a 90 degree and 30 degree heel forward at the final strokes of each stone so you can easily see the stria.

You may also try adding an additional layer of tape and ensuring that your tape is not worn through.

If you can, post a photo of the razor with a close up of the bevel on both sides.

Although not directed to me, your reply and your video have been most helpful. Not to hijack the thread, but I too am learning on the hones and your video has helped to provide some solid starting points for the new person to look for when examining a blade to determine its condition.

Subscribed.

Frank

Frank, it is all about the bevel set. Until you can tell for sure the bevels are meeting, you are in the dark, wasting time and steel. While all these thread may be written as a response to an individual, they are posted here for the hundreds of other readers who are attempting to solve the same problem. Once you understand how to determine if the bevel is set, for sure you are 95 percent done. The rest is just polishing.

It really should not take too much time to set the bevel and do a whole progression for that matter.

Good strong light, marker ink to monitor your progress and magnification will speed your progress as you understand/see what is happening to the bevel and the part pressure plays, good and bad.

As Wade said killing or jointing the edge is a good way to get to good steel if too much pressure has been used at low grit stones. I do one or two lite strokes on the corner of the stone to remove the crumbling edge, then rebuild the edge with lite finishing strokes. It may take 2-3 times to get to good steel.
What you will have to learn for your self is about pressure, as Onimaru says. Pressure on the stones, pressure on the strop, and pressure on you face.

Less is more. It’s not about speed, it’s about the quality of the edge.

Originally Posted by spacex

It would be super helpful if someone knowledgeable made a video about honing a shoulder-less razor like the Bismarck, from bevel setting all the way to finishing. There seem to be ton of videos on straight razors that have shoulders.

One day, I would make one myself when I become good at it.

There are no videos on the difference because it's not that big of a deal. I've never even thought about it except for the times when i bump the stabilizer into the stone. You are chasing the wrong ball there. If you're putting that much flex into the blade then you need to stop with hollow grinds and get a wedge. But i still say wrong ball.

I do prefer non-stablilized blades just for the extra clearance, (and cleaner lines). but it has nothing to do with how i drag 'em over the rocks.

--

What makes a real difference is a curved blade (smiling) or blades with swoopy toe and heel (like my 15/16 Barber's Rattler) that one must learn how to "chase" TMI for now.. I don't think your blades are such, but that as mentioned before there might be some warpage, or by this point in time, some hone wear issues. Best of luck. Oh and i did not mention killing the edge on the stone as i'm afraid you'd do a lot of damage with your pressure levels. Study TNT. If you do it too hard you'll cut yourself, but even done lightly will kill your edge and you can learn AHT at the same time. If you kill and edge on the stone, just use "touch" pressure-kissing the stone uber ultra super lightly, that's all it takes. AHT to confirm, then start over.

Originally Posted by Euclid440

Frank, it is all about the bevel set. Until you can tell for sure the bevels are meeting, you are in the dark, wasting time and steel. While all these thread may be written as a response to an individual, they are posted here for the hundreds of other readers who are attempting to solve the same problem. Once you understand how to determine if the bevel is set, for sure you are 95 percent done. The rest is just polishing.

It really should not take too much time to set the bevel and do a whole progression for that matter.

Good strong light, marker ink to monitor your progress and magnification will speed your progress as you understand/see what is happening to the bevel and the part pressure plays, good and bad.

As Wade said killing or jointing the edge is a good way to get to good steel if too much pressure has been used at low grit stones. I do one or two lite strokes on the corner of the stone to remove the crumbling edge, then rebuild the edge with lite finishing strokes. It may take 2-3 times to get to good steel.
What you will have to learn for your self is about pressure, as Onimaru says. Pressure on the stones, pressure on the strop, and pressure on you face.

Less is more. It’s not about speed, it’s about the quality of the edge.

Thank you for the direction and advice. I've set bevels twice and both passed TNT and TPT as well as easily sliced into a cherry tomato with little effort. The remaining progression on Naniwa stones were basically following along with what Lynn shows in his video.

I've really not experienced any real trouble on the 1K during a bevel set with my little experience. But, I want to learn as much as possible from others and enjoy smoother shaves with each old razor I find and try to get ready for shaving.

Frank

Originally Posted by Lakebound

Thank you for the direction and advice. I've set bevels twice and both passed TNT and TPT as well as easily sliced into a cherry tomato with little effort.

Why would you sllce an acidic fruit like a tomato with your razor ?

Develop your TPT, it really is the quickest, best, non destructive test. but takes some time to calibrate.

Touch every sharp object you can, knives, razors, single and double edged razor blades and calibrate the TPT for your thumb.

A razor edge is really a fragile thing. Once the bevel is set, it is sharp everything else is for comfort... and a bit more sharpness.

Originally Posted by onimaru55

Why would you sllce an acidic fruit like a tomato with your razor ?

maybe that's one of them knife sharper tricks? too much utoob? i wouldn't. nosiree. I have a sharp (carbon) deba for that porpoise.

Hanging hair test is just that a TEST. The true TEST is the SHAVE

Originally Posted by onimaru55

Why would you sllce an acidic fruit like a tomato with your razor ?

Some follow certain others who also hone. According this chap, he tests his razors with it so I have tried it as a test. Maybe it's just as useless as the HHT.

I'm here to learn.

Frank