Thread: 3 Videos ..Bevel setting / Synthetics / Nagura Progression.

I like your minimalist honing approach. It is something I too have been experimenting with for a while.

It may seem contrary to many here, where we often talk about” Maxing out” each stone.

Really once the bevel is “fully” set, the rest is just polish, and you don’t even have to polish the whole bevel, just the edge. For many knowing a fully set edge can be challenging, so over-honing/maxing each stone is a simple sure way to get and keep an edge.

It is more of an advanced technique, or more way of thinking, may be worthy of its own thread.

I think that the less trauma caused to the apex would make for a less chippy edge. You can see under a microscope that one or two extra strokes on bevel set with a T.I or Dovo can cause some chipping and in my mind that is where weepers come from when going atg around the chin for example.

I wouldn't say that other honing techniques would not get good results but i only know what i know and i don't know what others know

Years ago, there was some discussion on edge impact, with respect to diamond plates and even aggressive sanding belts during the manufacturing process.

Steel does have a memory, look at the inside of any automotive body damage repair or damaged steel with a microscope. Damage goes deep.

It has to have a lasting impact, so anything one can do to minimize impact damage will make a stronger edge.

That makes sense .

Honing is a controversial subject if you consider what has been said over the years on many forums...many arguments.

Luckily here at SRP there is some form of structure . Probably because many have stuck around for such a long time.

Best Straight Razor forum this side of the mississippi

I’m a bit suspicious of the edge impact being damaging, though it may well be, I’m just not seeing anything definite, just speculation. Steel undergoes a lot of impact effect during forging, from hand hammers to power hammers to drop forges. People generally consider this impact process beneficial though the steel is usually at a plastic temperature during these processes and it’s happening before quenching and tempering.

We do know that flexing a metal can cause it to harden or become brittle, you can bend a piece of soft iron at normal temperatures back and forth until it breaks at the bend. But does that effect happen at a razors edge from diamond plates or sanding belts? I don’t think we know...

Yes, the fabrication is brutal and impacting, but after rough grinding the steel is tempered and normalized in effort to relax the steel and amalgamate the stress and steel uniformly.

It is after this process that the steel, the edge is re-introduced to stress, though much less by the final grind with aggressive Diamond and Ceramic belts and again possibly during the honing process.

When you have a chipping issue on a hard razor or one that has undergone edge restoration, buffing, chip removal or reshaping. A quick simple solution is to remove a bit of metal and re-set the edge or produce a wider angle that will offer more support, (Micro Bevel).

Whatever the cause, getting to solid steel is the cure. Steel impact damage is well documented. Steel can not be cleanly cut off, even with a laser or water jet, there is always some microscopic deformation, the molecules must go somewhere.

Hardening probably makes it worse, locking microscopic blocks of steel together, that resist cutting and chip.

Until someone makes a real time X ray, Micrographic video of the inside of the steel as it is cut, we may never know for sure. It has always been controversial, much like honing, because we cannot see what is happening at the edge when it is happening.

It is an interesting subject, and while we may not know exactly why, avoiding it is easy and proven solutions exist.

Interesting vids, Joseph-I need to experiment around more with DMT slurry on the mid-range synth as you do on your 5k. I've done it on my Norton 4k, but haven't made it a habit unless the edge coming off the 1k was not optimal. I am also trying to get into the habit of jointing and then resetting before finishing up on each stone as Marty has always advocated.

As for the minimalist honing approach, I may have to restrain myself and give that a go on a couple of razors. I am one of the ones often talking about "maxing out" on any given hone, and if anything, I have probably done too many strokes at times trying to tweak that last little bit out of a stone with a couple of final feather-light sets.

By the way, what happened to those massive black and trans Arkansas stones you lapped and prepped some time back? They were some of the biggest, prettiest arks I have ever seen-now that would be a cool video!

Originally Posted by ScoutHikerDad

Interesting vids, Joseph-I need to experiment around more with DMT slurry on the mid-range synth as you do on your 5k. I've done it on my Norton 4k, but haven't made it a habit unless the edge coming off the 1k was not optimal. I am also trying to get into the habit of jointing and then resetting before finishing up on each stone as Marty has always advocated.

As for the minimalist honing approach, I may have to restrain myself and give that a go on a couple of razors. I am one of the ones often talking about "maxing out" on any given hone, and if anything, I have probably done too many strokes at times trying to tweak that last little bit out of a stone with a couple of final feather-light sets.

By the way, what happened to those massive black and trans Arkansas stones you lapped and prepped some time back? They were some of the biggest, prettiest arks I have ever seen-now that would be a cool video!

Hi Aaron,
I have never understood ppl doing untold laps especially on fine stones. However, if it works then it works. Many ways to skin a cat.

Those Arks are packed away . I dont know what to do with them at the moment. I need to put down the Jnats and focus on synthetics finishing with Arks & Eschers for shave videos etc. The problem is nothing can touch my Jnats and Nagurs , especially if we are talking wedges ...

They would make a good video
Cheers and thanks..
Joseph

Originally Posted by JOB15

They would make a good video
Cheers and thanks..
Joseph

Like that thinking!

Thanks for the videos Joseph, I too like the minimalist approach.

I have a question please - do you only kill the edge on the bevel set and then on the next stone up (5k in your video). This would apply to any stone that follows the bevel set on synth progression - be it 3k or 4K or 5k?