Thread: Need advice for hone purchase.

Hey guys,

I'm ready to start my research for the best deal and right equipment I need to keep my razor sharp. From watching Lynn's DVD I'm thinking I need a Norton 4000/8000 and a Belgian yellow coticule stone for finishing.

I read the honing section of the wiki, which then said that maybe I would only need the belgian yellow stone to restore a blade that has simply dulled to shave ready. So now I'm confused.

I don't plan on buying razors from Ebay or anything like that, I simply want to keep the current razor I have as sharp as it came to me. So no restoration work or anything like that. If I buy another razor in the future I'll buy one that's shave ready, or send it to someone like Lynn who can make it shave ready for me.

So that said, what's your guy's advice for which hones to buy?

If I buy a belgian yellow stone, is it alright that it seems to be hard to find a 3" width stone now? Does the width matter all that much if you use the proper x pattern? Or does it just mean you'd need more passes than if you had a wider stone?

The Perfect Edge (mentioned in the Wiki) has an 8"x2" stone for a decent price, but then the Invisible Edge has what they call "bouts" which aren't rectangular, but are intended to be used for sharpening razors. Can anyone comment whether the bouts are a good idea or bad for a newbie like me?

Thanks again,

Rob

I think for a new honer the Norton is the way to go. The coticule is a great stone and after you have learned to hone would be a nice addition. I love them and I'm glad I have them but I am also glad I started on the Norton first. Just IMHO .... one of many no doubt.

I wouldn't recommend a bout unless it's more rectangular. If your new to honing, you want to give yourself every advantage. A Coticule is good for making your blade shave ready and as a finisher. They are multi purpose, and each one is sort of unique. Some are slow, some are fast, etc...So, you may get one that will take you some time to get your blade sharp. 8x3 can be had, but they run around 250.00+

I don't know if it's really a beginner's hone. Too many variables. The Norton's and The Naniwa's give consistent results. I would get some Naniwa's, a 3k and 8k or a 5k and an 8k. Get the 12k and you have a finisher. Get a wool felt strop and some Diamond spray and your regular strop and your good to go.....My two cents....

P.S. Looks like my friend Jimmy beat my to the punch, but we both agree....

Rich

Coticules are great great stones, and I personally love them (my personal favorite stone)... HOWEVER, I am not sure they are ideal for beginners. Yes, you can take a Coticule and set the bevel of a razor and work it all the way to a great shaving razor, but it takes significantly more strokes and skill to do it. For new honers, I agree with Jimmy that a synthetic setup is most likely to yield good results, decrease frustration, and lead to continued success. Nortons, Shaptons, and Naniwas are among the most common synthetic systems, and I recommend one of them because of that (there is more collective knowledge about them than any other that I'm aware of).

Like I said, Coticules are my personal favorite, but I honestly don't know if I would have stuck with honing if that was my first tool. I guess the point is that you need to really research all your options and go in with realistic expectations.... Best of luck with your decision.

EDIT: I see Rich jumped in while I was responding... 3 for 3 hmmm LOL

Jimmy are you saying then that the Norton 4000/8000 will be enough to get the razor back to shave ready if it was properly honed to begin with? That's good to hear.

Thanks zib for the tip on the coticule, that makes sense to me since it's a natural stone that each one would be different.

Originally Posted by RobertH

Jimmy are you saying then that the Norton 4000/8000 will be enough to get the razor back to shave ready if it was properly honed to begin with? That's good to hear.

Thanks zib for the tip on the coticule, that makes sense to me since it's a natural stone that each one would be different.

yes... in skilled hands, a 8K is plenty. In fact, it is commonly recommended that new honers don't get anything beyond that until they can get good shaving results off the 8k.

Originally Posted by richmondesi

yes... in skilled hands, a 8K is plenty. In fact, it is commonly recommended that new honers don't get anything beyond that until they can get good shaving results off the 8k.

+1 on that.

Originally Posted by RobertH

I don't plan on buying razors from Ebay or anything like that, I simply want to keep the current razor I have as sharp as it came to me. So no restoration work or anything like that. If I buy another razor in the future I'll buy one that's shave ready, or send it to someone like Lynn who can make it shave ready for me.

This is the most important part so since you're past it the rest is easy.

There are a lot of options that will work well for this purpose, so it's a matter to just pick one. A small (read below) coticule would be a fine choice and I personally would recommend it over a norton. The advantages are less maintenance and more convenience, the main disadvantage is the slightly higher price and a bit trickier than norton if you end up with a too dull razor (microbevelling with a layer of tape is a quick workaround t this).

Now the size. Historically the optimal size for a touch-up hone is around 2" x 4"-5". That's the size of the barber hones and quite a bit of coticules sold to barbers. 2"x8" is certanly way more hone than you need.
So a bout coticule is a good choice, as long as it's not 3"x3".
The advantage of a coticule over a barbers hone is that it's slower and generally more newbie friendly.

My first touch up job was using a 1" x 4.5" or 5" thuringian and it worked perfectly. I don't consider myself particularly skilled, so I'd say at least 60%-70% of the people can be at least as successful as me.

The amount of metal that needs to be removed to maintain an already well honed razor is minimal, that's why coticule works really well even though it's much slower than a norton. The key is to use a good stroke, uniform and light. Most new guys have trouble with it because for some reason they think they need to feel the metal being removed, so they instead dull the razor with way too much pressure which just causes too much metal to be reomoved in very uneven fashion.

I'm new to honing myself. I have several Naniwa's which I've used with moderate success.

Then, last weekend, I visited Bart who tought me how to use a small vintage coticule I had (3.3cm x 15cm) ("unicot" method). It did effectively take a long time to get the job done but I ended up with an extremely sharp razor and had a verrrry smooth shave.

For me the conclusion is that I actually don't need the Naniwa's and that even for a beginner in honing like myself it's feasible to use a coticule.

And also very important I think: there's the difference in price: coticule's like the one I have are quite cheap compared to even one Naniwa !

Originally Posted by RobertH

I don't plan on buying razors from Ebay or anything like that, I simply want to keep the current razor I have as sharp as it came to me.

Suuuuure, I believe ya.
I started out like that as well ....