Thread: Question on Spine Taping and Angle

I've read plenty on honing and have watched lots of videos, but I'm left with a question I cannot find the answer to. I understand why the spine is taped, to avoid wear on the spine. What I don't understand is what angle the blade should be held at. I'm assuming that the blade is held flat on a 1000 grit stone, and that is why the spine is taped to avoid wear. But I've watched videos where after the 4000 grit stone is used and the honer moves on to 8000 grit, the tape is then removed. Is the blade still held flat at this point? Is it possible to remove the tape from the spine at this point because the grit is so fine that the spine will only be polished and not scraped or damaged? I'm sorry if this question has been dealt with elsewhere, but I couldn't find it. And thanks in advance for your consideration and assistance.

Some guys tape the spine at all times and others sometimes depending on the situation and/or the razor involved. The only time to ever lift the spine when honing AFAIC is if you are removing a large chip and you are on a low grit stone for maximum metal removal. That is more restoration than honing though and rarely encountered by the average user IMO. Most of the time chip removal is accomplished keeping the spine on the hone and if it is a large chip and a low grit hone tape is probably a good idea. There are quite a few threads on the pros and cons of taping if you do a search you'll come up with a considerable amount of info. Other than noted above the spine and bevel should be on the hone at all times.

Thanks for the helpful reply. In the case of a really fine Straight, the spine on the stone won't cause damage above 4000 grit, and it probably would at the 1000 grit level? I'm just trying to make sure that in honing I won't be harming the polish of the blade. And I'll do a taping search as well. Again, thanks!

Originally Posted by ace

In the case of a really fine Straight, the spine on the stone won't cause damage above 4000 grit, and it probably would at the 1000 grit level?

I think it depends on the skill of the honer. A heavy handed honer might cause some wear. Just from my own experience, I honed all razors with tape my first year doing it because I was afraid of causing excessive spine wear.

After a year or so I felt more confident in my ability and began trying it without tape. I took a micrometer and measured the spine on a new old stock vintage razor before I honed it and after. This included setting the bevel on a 1k stone and using the pyramid method with the 4/8 norton and finishing on a higher grit. In that particular razor there was no appreciable spine wear.

I've continued honing without tape since then. The only time I use tape is on Damascus (pattern welded steel) razors to avoid taking off the surface etching. Nothing wrong with using tape and if I honed for other people I probably would. As it is I only hone my own so that isn't an issue. So far I've had no issues with untoward spine wear.

I get your point on the spine not being eroded significantly by the honing without tape. I guess I'm concerned more about appearance, say in the example of a beautifully polished blade. Will honing without taping change the appearance of the blade, reduce the shine or polish? Also, at what grit level is that no longer an issue? I can imagine it might be at 1000 grit, but would the finish no longer be affected by the hone at the 4000 grit level? Again, thanks for the replies.

Regardless of the grit level it will polish the steel at the spine and leave a scratch pattern as it does at the bevel. If you're just starting out there is nothing at all wrong with one layer of electrical tape. I liked 3M because it is made in Minneapolis and is a consistent thickness. Some of the imported stuff can vary IME.

+1 to the 3m Jimmy...If I have to use Tape, it's their Scotch 33+. Excellent...
I don't tape as a rule, unless the previous owner tells me he used to tape to set the bevel or what have you...Like Jimmy said, there no real wear, if I have to use like a 400 grit hone, which I have a few times for faster chip removal, I've taped...
Or if it's a fancy spine, or like Jimmy said, Damascus steel...Yes, good point, The tape does stay on all the way through...

I just recently heard about lifting the spine to remove chips faster...Makes sense, and if your a knife guy, like me...Maintaining an angle should be no problem..I would not recommend this move to a novice honer...

The great thing about sharpening straight razors is the angle is built in...For normal honing, You just lay it flat on the stone, smooth controlled movements, and no pressure...

One thing from the original post that didn't get brought up - If you set the bevel with tape, you need to keep the same amount of tape on all the way through (unless you reset the bevel after taking the tape off). Otherwise, you will only be polishing the back of the bevel, as opposed to the whole bevel from the edge back.

Thanks for all the help, and I now appreciate that the spine serves as a guide, with or without tape, to establish the angle for the bevel.

My question is "What effect does that have on the spine, not so much regarding whether it is or is not reduced, but on how it looks?"

What if I take a brand new, all fancied-up Dubl Duck, with special scales on it and all, and attempt to hone it? Will that pretty blade be scratched up, the mirror finish ruined, by a couple passes at 400 grit without tape on the spine? And at what point in variable grit levels is disfiguring the mirror finish of the blade no longer a problem?

Sorry to be so persistent about this, but I would hate to hone a beautiful
blade and make it less pretty in the process.

Originally Posted by ace

Sorry to be so persistent about this, but I would hate to hone a beautiful
blade and make it less pretty in the process.

Tape your beautiful blade and when you acquire a plain blade with no wear on the spine give that one a try. For me I wouldn't be honing a razor on a 400 grit unless I was removing a large chip. I generally start at 1k or higher. Anyhow, ease into it with taping your spines and do like I did with trying it without tape after you feel confident in your skills. Just don't try it with no tape unless it is a blade that your not worried about causing spine wear. IME it takes a while to cause wear unless you have a heavy hand.