Thread: Too sharp?

It is true that the scope won't show sharpness, as Jimbo said. So, the microscope might or might help. In my opinion, most of the problems with a blade are due to edge and bevel abnormalities that are visible to the microscope. Maybe, a serrated looked edge, or wavy edge that isn't perfectly straight, or deep gouges in the blade that you don't think should exist. Something like that.

Sorry Larry -I deleted my post. For some reason after the first edit the last paragraph refused to show, and in the end I gave up trying to fight with it.

James.

Originally Posted by Jimbo

Sorry Larry -I deleted my post. For some reason after the first edit the last paragraph refused to show, and in the end I gave up trying to fight with it. James.

But, you made some great points! Even half your thoughts were better than nothing! But, I understand that it might not have been complete and you might not have wanted it sent to everyone.

When I first came around to SRP there was a school of thought that edges should be smoothed of any scratch pattern left by the previous grit before moving to the next grit. If you were influenced by this school, or were an adherent to that proposition, obviously you needed a microscope. Fortunately for me, at the time, I got a variety of shave ready razors from some of the best honemeisters.

I was able to examine those with my B&L 40x stereo scope and see that the shave ready edges , honed by the honemeisters had definite scratch patterns. The no scratch school was largely made up of guys who honed Japanese tools, planes, chisels and such where, if I understand it correctly, beauty of the finished bevel is paramount.

So I focused on sharpening the razor and paid no attention to the scratch pattern removal. When a bevel passed the TNT I went on to the sharpening. When it was good on the TPT and popping hair off my arm or leg on to the finishing. I will always check for micro chipping or other anomalies before I start honing and sometimes while I'm making progress.

Other than the preliminary examination I rarely use the microscope anymore. I depend on my 30x eye loupe as I hone and that has been working very well for me. My microscope is relegated to checking tattooing needles that I solder into groups and onto bars for work. The reason I got it in the first place.

It is pretty rare these days that I will go to the microscope unless I can't get the edge where I want it. It definitely is a good tool though. As far as the notion of too sharp, I remain pretty lost. I have been on the hunt for the "Perfect Edge" forever and would say that I still am. So to me, that means an edge that is perfectly sharp and provides a perfectly smooth and perfectly close shave. This is why I like the shave test so much........I think.....lol. But in any case, every time I think I have the perfect shave, I just keep looking for a more perfect shave. The differences between a really nice shave and a great shave and a perfect shave seem awful minute, but when you have one you know..............and when it comes from a razor you honed, you'll enjoy it all the better. That really is perfect!

Have fun.

I agree with JimmyHAD about scratch patterns. Say you have a 6 hone progression. By the time you are on your last hone, in all likelihood the "evidence" left by the 3rd hone will be metal shavings in your water pan or on the hone. So, I can't get too concerned about what was done on the previous hones.

Basically, you can hone smart or not. But, even if you hone poorly on many of the hones, or take way too much time, or hone with figure 8s instead of figure Zs, you might still get a good edge.

As everyone says, the results are what counts. And, shaving is the result.

I don't use a microscope but a 30X Loupe and it is excellent for setting a bevel and checking for micro-chipping. When I started out I used it a lot more than I do now. Once you have been honing a while you can usually feel the edge on a stone that have used a lot and can usually tell if something it wrong. I keep track of the honing process by looking at the reflecting light on the bevel. It tells a lot.

Take Care,
Richard

Last night I honed my razor. I used the 1K GS to do some bevel work. Basically I used a few light passes and evened out the bevel as best I could, observed using the light refelction. Honestly it didn't need much work. Prior, I could see some areas that were catching light.

Then I did a pyramid set on the 4k & 8k GS's. Not excatly to the set listed on the site here, but something like 20-20, 16-20, 12-20, 10-16, etc. At the end the edge felt sharp and "grabby"; it would pop arm hair w/out touching the skin. The edge would grab the standing hairs and with a slight pressure woul dbite into them and pop them off.

From there I preceeded to judiciously strop on boron on balsa, cro on balsa and plain leather.

The edge was sharp, but when I shaved w/ it, it wasn't what I would call smooth. It was still a bit grabby, and when I did the ATG pass I got quite a few ___, what is it called when you sorta shave the top of a hair folicle off and get a micro cut or razor burn? The edge wasn't noticeably better than before when I've done a simple 4k to 8k progression and then some stropping. Not saying that the pyramid wasn't useful. I think there's somehting in my stropping equipment/technique.

I think my next investment is gonna be a higher grit finishig stone in the 12k-20k range. Suggestions? Thanks again to everyone for the great feedback! Cheers! mpp

IMHO you should work on getting good shaving edges from your 8k before you move to higher grit stones.
If your edge is not good off 8k it will not improve by adding a finer stone.

That being said the options for high grit stones are multiple, and depending on price too.
Synthetics : Naniwa 12k SS, 16k GS.
Naturals:Fine Coticule, Thuringian, Escher, Jnat,

I would try the more traditional pyramid before you totally make up your mind. You still may like the other way better in any case. I would go 15-15, 10-10, 5-5, 1-3 and 1-5. Then if needed, you can always either repeat the 1-3 and 1-5 or just try 5 no pressure X strokes on the 8K. Actually you can even try the final pyramids now to see if it improves that edge a little.