Thread: Straights for Heavy Beards?

I will say for my experience both blades being of equal sharpness a wedge blade inspires greater shaving confidence. I am going to agree with mass and Inertia being a big player in this. The heavier weight of the blade tends to help my hand muscles understand whats going on with the shave better. This of course is just my own dexterity issues and my hand prefers a heavier tool. I can shave much faster and with confidence with a wedge type blade, the strokes are smoother and deliberate no hesitation and I believe the razor weight is helping with this as i seem to fuss less about cutting angle and pressure. I love my hollow blades as well certainly a different experience. When I first started using Extra Hollow grinds they inspired a bit of fear and hesitation, imagined or not they felt less forgiving and dangerous to me whether that was the flexing of the blade or just that they were so light and demonically sharp, I felt the need to really pay attention to pressure and angle and found due to my apprehensions the blade would skip and chatter across my face inspiring more and more hesitation, the enemy of a good shave. I have since made friends with all my shavers and in the end its really about understanding the nature of your tools. I don't believe one is better than another as far as shaving hair off your face but I can see how personal preference plays a huge role here we are all different some folks like a big hammer others would rather hit a nail more with a lighter one.

Originally Posted by Razorfaust

I will say they were so light and demonically sharp,.

Totally stolen description for how I like my razors edge!
Thanks.

Originally Posted by Mephisto

Every time a thread like this pops up, standard statements are made that heavier grinds are easier to use or the heavier grind compensates for poor technique. I'm sorry but there is really not a science to any of this. We can make speculations. We can rely on some understanding of basic physics and geometry. We just do not have an hard evidence one way or the other.

There was marketing back in the day just as today but makers instructions that I archived here all suggest good lather & laying the razor flat on the face for good results. 2 things people just don't get a handle on immediately or even after some time.

http://straightrazorpalace.com/shavi...ng-basics.html

The only one that suggests not using a thin grind on coarse beards is Torrey but the caveat in red is the thing.

"For a heavy coarse beard, a too thin-ground blade should not be used unless one is somewhat of an expert in handling a razor"


Most of us that are suggesting grind is irrelevant have decades of experience so can use any grind. There are other factors at play other than grind so let's all come back to this thread in another 10 years or so & see if our "opinions" change. If I'm still alive I know I'll still be able to use any grind unless I get lazy & just use my slant

Originally Posted by onimaru55

There was marketing back in the day just as today but makers instructions that I archived here all suggest good lather & laying the razor flat on the face for good results. 2 things people just don't get a handle on immediately or even after some time.

http://straightrazorpalace.com/shavi...ng-basics.html
The only one that suggests not using a thin grind on coarse beards is Torrey but the caveat in red is the thing.

"For a heavy coarse beard, a too thin-ground blade should not be used unless one is somewhat of an expert in handling a razor


Most of us that are suggesting grind is irrelevant have decades of experience so can use any grind. There are other factors at play other than grind so let's all come back to this thread in another 10 years or so & see if our "opinions" change. If I'm still alive I know I'll still be able to use any grind unless I get lazy & just use my slant

Thats fine. Thanks. Btw, I am not saying I cannot use follow hollow razors. I am just saying I like shaving with 1/4 hollows and half-hollow razors. Yes, I imagine after time, if I continue to use full hollow razors, I will become even more proficient. I am not really too worried about it though.

I mean I have a Grelot which is 3/4 hollow which I like. Technically, it is a hollow grind, not really a singer, but fairly close. I have another TI, which is full follow, not as thinly ground as some razors, but what I feel is a full hollow. It is a pretty decent shaver. I used it today and got a really good shave with it. The edge has to be dialed in just right. I mean I have had pro honed razors that did not meet my needs. I generally have to dial them in to my comfort level. Still, if the steel is too soft, it just does not work.

I feel there is nothing wrong with suggesting heavier grinds to people with certain hair types, especially when starting out. I can only suggest from my experience and the first really good shaves came with a half-hollow razor.


.........btw, laying the razor flat does not work really well for me. I do try the technique at times, but I really do not see a difference except when using an ATG pass on my neck.

It seems Robison Cutlery knew about good grinds for types of beards. A shame I cannot seem to get the RobisonRME website to work. A thread; http://straightrazorpalace.com/razor...tang-tail.html
I also often wonder where the recommendations for the many, many different grinds Henckels produced are.

Just for information's sake, I remember Bigspendur (tell me if I am wrong?) relating in a thread a while back that the Special Wedge DublDuck was produced out of sheer demand from barbers as the Satinwedge had been discontinued.
There was,is, will continue to be interest in wedge-type and heavy shavers. Barbers no longer dictate what is what.
The individual does. Absolutely not a professional cranking out the shaves on different beard types.
Just guys getting a good shave with what they like. So what if newer-production blades are mostly thinner ground?
Selling them does not trump what some like. Goes to show some like thin, some heavy. Some BOTH!
Insulting over someone else's preference is wrong. Everyone gets an opinion, I think!
The subject is completely subjective and should NOT result in arguments, nor bans.
In a perfect world, I suppose!
Shave On, Gents!

Being the least "expert" and experienced among all (ok, most) of you, my face, with my technique (which is all I have), do better with a heavier grind. Extra hollow ground razors, of which I have two (for now), don't do it for me, even when freshly honed...they just are less comfortable, especially if I skip a day.

I'll be "re-tooling" soon...watch the classifieds if you like em thin!

Originally Posted by Haroldg48

Being the least "expert" and experienced among all (ok, most) of you, my face, with my technique (which is all I have), do better with a heavier grind. Extra hollow ground razors, of which I have two (for now), don't do it for me, even when freshly honed...they just are less comfortable, especially if I skip a day.

I'll be "re-tooling" soon...watch the classifieds if you like em thin!

Hang on to those thin ones, Harold! Always a place for them !

Originally Posted by sharptonn

It seems Robison Cutlery knew about good grinds for types of beards. A shame I cannot seem to get the RobisonRME website to work. A thread; http://straightrazorpalace.com/razor...tang-tail.html

I would recommend brushing up on Robeson's booklet before making statements about its 'knowledge' content.
It's the same booklet that talks about razor teeth and asserts without any justification whatsoever that "it is unreasonable to expect" a razor "forged from an excellent grade of steel, properly hardened and tempered, honed and stropped to a fine edge" will shave "with exactly the same results" "a truck driver as compared with a bank clerk".

Then they propose that the main distinction is the razor teeth and analogous to a saw "a Razor with fine teeth is best suited for a fine or medium beard, while a Razor with coarse teeth is better for tough wiry beard".

As far as I can tell only three razors among the 12 that are listed are not full hollow (they have single stabilizer instead of double) and the common factor among them is not the beard type, but the skin exposure to the outdoors.
The sketches of people with supposedly tender and very tender skins are interesting - I'd call them 'better off' than the others.

I like Robeson razors, but for the time being I call malarky on that booklet. I need to see the edges of those different razors when honed to our normal standards and if there are indeed teeth of different coarseness I'd be up for testing the theory of the 'razor that fits your face'. According to the illustrations pen me down for "Wiry Beard, Very Tender Skin"

Originally Posted by sharptonn

Insulting over someone else's preference is wrong.

Of course it is. Who is insulting people (for their preferences or anything else), I must've missed that.

Originally Posted by sharptonn

The subject is completely subjective

I'm still waiting for the explanation how the mass/weight/inertia or its flexibility is subjective. Or the number of razors produced in different grinds and sizes.
If we can't acknowledge that there are fundamentally objective quantities such as mass and elastic modulus, I don't see how we'll ever get back to the point when people can take the time to read what somebody is saying said before the figurative shooting from the hip in retaliation for 'being insulted'.

The flexibility of my massive inertia is subjective to my old age & weight,,,,,

Originally Posted by gugi

I would recommend brushing up on Robeson's booklet before making statements about its 'knowledge' content.
It's the same booklet that talks about razor teeth and asserts without any justification whatsoever that "it is unreasonable to expect" a razor "forged from an excellent grade of steel, properly hardened and tempered, honed and stropped to a fine edge" will shave "with exactly the same results" "a truck driver as compared with a bank clerk".

Then they propose that the main distinction is the razor teeth and analogous to a saw "a Razor with fine teeth is best suited for a fine or medium beard, while a Razor with coarse teeth is better for tough wiry beard".

As far as I can tell only three razors among the 12 that are listed are not full hollow (they have single stabilizer instead of double) and the common factor among them is not the beard type, but the skin exposure to the outdoors.
The sketches of people with supposedly tender and very tender skins are interesting - I'd call them 'better off' than the others.

I like Robeson razors, but for the time being I call malarky on that booklet. I need to see the edges of those different razors when honed to our normal standards and if there are indeed teeth of different coarseness I'd be up for testing the theory of the 'razor that fits your face'. According to the illustrations pen me down for "Wiry Beard, Very Tender Skin"


Of course it is. Who is insulting people (for their preferences or anything else), I must've missed that.


I'm still waiting for the explanation how the mass/weight/inertia or its flexibility is subjective. Or the number of razors produced in different grinds and sizes.
If we can't acknowledge that there are fundamentally objective quantities such as mass and elastic modulus, I don't see how we'll ever get back to the point when people can take the time to read what somebody is saying said before the figurative shooting from the hip in retaliation for 'being insulted'.

Wow! That speaks volumes. I suppose you told ME! Thanks for posting it, Ivan. It is simply about what some like. Not a scientific thing which can only be interpreted by a few. Not really an argument whatsoever, IMHO.
Now, guys can read and understand. Like it or not, My Friend, it will be subjective long after you and I are gone.
Enjoy yourself here. I shan't be back! The thread is your's and all conclusions, the last word, as well.
I have great respect for you. I know you are quite intelligent. Constant reminders there. I just wish your battles were better selected in promoting this forum instead of promoting divisiveness, which seems obvious here.
Best to you. Better days?
Tom