Thread: New Boker razors

Originally Posted by Leighton

I'm sorry, but it doesn't. It only makes sense with full hollow razors. 1/4 hollow and thicker will not bend on your thumbnail. Its too thick, your nail will break before the razor will bend.

No sir, your nail will not brake.... and the steel will bend.
This attached photo may help.
While not a NOS razor, but you can see the bevel is small, maybe smaller than most full hollow ground razors, the part near the edge is very thin and does in fact bend beyond the bevel under mild pressure form the thumbnail...

Any properly tempered and ground Near Wedge blade will do this.

I must also point out... This is in NO WAY anything like the Thumb-Nail-Test. In this case the blade is held flat against the thumbnail near the edge, and the thumbnail is pushed sideways against the bevel, and you can carefully slide the thumbnail along the length of the edge.

Originally Posted by Leighton

Works only with full hollows because they are thin enough to flex. However, the too brittle and it will break theory also makes no sense. If it was that brittle it wouldn't even hone properly, let alone survive the grinding/polishing. Too soft makes sense. But if it was that soft, they probably just forgot to heat treat it. And even then, I'm not entirely sure steel is that soft.

In those days razors were made mostly by hand. Evan today razors are still made by hand by a few manufacturers’. Mistakes can and do happen and it is not unlikely back then mistakes would happen more often than today and a few improperly ground or improperly tempered ("or forgot to heat treat") would get into the hands of customers. It is tests such as this one the customer will have an idea if he bought a good one or a lemon.

I still don't see how effective that test is. The steel would have to be incredibly brittle or incredibly soft to give a different result.

If you could explain it to me, I am willing to listen. But as it is, I just don't understand.

Originally Posted by wopmanfixit

This may be old news, but I was looking at the German Boker website and it looks like they're serious about getting back into straights. They have 3 new razors becoming available this month and July. Here's a link.

Böker Solingen - Taschenmesser, Fahrtenmesser und Küchenmesser made in Solingen :: Rasiermesser

I have Boker King Cutter and Edelweiss razors on order. I will post them as soon as they arrive.

Originally Posted by littlesilverbladefromwale

I think Bokers statement, or translation of their statement is a bit 'off the mark'. I can see what they mean though about very finely ground or "extra hollow ground" razors. I think they were the final evolution of straight razors during the era of their widespread use.
Something else I've noticed, I have seen old razors that say "extra hollow ground" or similar statements on them, when they are clearly not.
Were these makers trying to get the public to buy their out dated, heavy, hard to sharpen razors by making false statements on their products? Even though today we enjoy the heft of heavy grinds, the average punter in the past would have struggled to make them keen at home. And don't forget, they only wanted a shave!
I wonder if the ability to produce a very fine (I mean thin) razor wasn't within the capabilities of many cutlers/grinders?
I'd imagine they are really hard to grind that fine too.
Here is a challenge, could one of the custom makers copy a Gotta 120
Saying that, I think Dovo and TI still produce "Singing edge" razors
M

Full hollow, extra hollow, 1/1 hollow ground it doesn't matter to a lot of us. As a matter of fact the tougher the beard the better it is to use a stiffer blade like a quarter hollow or a larger blade like a 7/8.

Originally Posted by OutlawSkinnyD

if wacker is making the blades, why not just go get a wacker?

to me it doesnt seem like a real boker because its not being made by boker's guys. its wacker with boker name.


thats just me, i think they look beautiful tho.

Even when there were literally hundreds of small companies in addition to the "big dogs" making straight razors after WWII there were still only a few foundries and rht tool steel they all use was, and still is, the same for all of them. As long as it is ground by a compitant grinder and comes from Solingen it shouldn't matter who has branded it. solingen itself - the city brand - has quality specs that are supposed to be made before it can say Made In Solingen, Germany - and so does the Solingen Blade Guild.

Originally Posted by treydampier

I took a look at the new Boker site. Now, as a person with little experience, here are my thoughts. First, they are expensive as are the Dovo, TI, Puma, and other new razor manufacturers. To me they are much too expensive. That said what are you getting for the money. I do not believe for a second that any of these new companies are a bit better than W&B, Rogers, Genco, Maher and Groshe or many other English and American brand razors. The idea is to get a good shave. Even if you want a new razor, the idea to get a mid range razor costing in excess of $200 from these makers is absurd. As for the grinding and needing know how, any reasonable person knowing metals will know these are going to be ground with a computer run machine most likely. From what I have read here, TI is having quality issues ( and someone recently contacted me about honing a new one for them thought the salesman said it wasn't necessary), Puma appears to be doing well, and Dovo is just the biggest name out there in my mind. I don't particularly swear by their products, nor do I use anything they make except their strops. I started with their basic razor and have since moved on. So for those who want a new razor, by all means spend hundreds of dollars adn buy a new Boker, Dovo, or other new brand. All you will get is a razor that needs to be honed (if not pre-honed) and at best a great shave. As for me, I will take my $10 restores (bought off ebay) or other cheap razors in the classifieds by some of the sellers and get an equal or better shave than you will get spending hundreds.

Nope! sorry - they are still hand ground by craftsmen. They cost money and have to feed their family too. You are correct that the old american brands and Sheffield brands will give you just as good a shave. It is kind of like going from Miami to New York City in a 1961 Nash Rambler. it is still perfectly good transportation if properly maintained. I am not saying this in a derogatory manor either. A well maintained 1961 Nash Rambler would be a real rarity as are some of the well maintained older razors.

Originally Posted by Pyment

I was going over the revisor site and found this

Raritäten der Woche

The question arises in my mind. are these NOS, grinds of Boker blanks, or is Revisor making the new Boker straights?

I don't read German well enough to tell from the website and have sent them and email. I think that Boker would vigorously defend their name and if these aren't NOS, must be involved in some way.

Heribert Wacker is making the Boker razors right now. Judging by the new Wacker razors and the Boker.de film showing him making them by hand forging a blank - it seems that Boker invested in some die sets which was a farsighted move!

The problems usually occure in the hardening process. Many of the blades warp and some can be "popped" back to their original shape with a dead blow hammer hitting the blank on a leather pad. This usually works; however, sometimes there is a slight twist or bend in the blade that is not at all obvious. they can be made to look like a perfectly good razor and sold as such. This is not done purposfully - it is a QA mistake. Most of the time the twist or bend is so minute it isn't noticed until the first time you go to hone the new razor. If it is slightly bent you will take off metal at the heal and point on one side and only in the middle on the other. This is usually extremely minute but makes all the difference in the world when it comes to getting a good cutting bevel. If the razor is slightly twisted you will take off metal on the point end on one side and at the heal end on the other. As far as I am concerned these razors are pretty much total write offs. They will just never be right. They are rare but these problems happen once in a while to all of them. I have to say I have seen more older razors with these problems than new ones though.

Originally Posted by John Crowley

A well maintained 1961 Nash Rambler would be a real rarity as are some of the well maintained older razors.

My first car was a 1963 Rambler with push button transmission and a front seat that laid flat. I bought it from the elderly lady across the street and it only had 24,000 miles on it. It had fins.

They don't make 'em like that anymore!

Originally Posted by Leighton

I still don't see how effective that test is. The steel would have to be incredibly brittle or incredibly soft to give a different result.

If you could explain it to me, I am willing to listen. But as it is, I just don't understand.

You are correct, but it’s not simply a test for improperly treated steel.

The razor grinder uses it to know when to stop grinding in that area… he will know the razor is thin enough to be honed/maintained easily by the consumer.
It’s the skill and experience of the grinder that makes the difference… too thin and the razor is useless… too thick and he needs to thin it some more until its just right.

I hope that explains