Thread: question about tape

[QUOTE=JohnG10;756968]I don't tape the spine for normal honing chores. Using tape to hone garantees the edge will have a slightly more open angle. Narrower angles cut better. My feeling is that the flats on the spine are suppossed to wear down (get wider) as you hone off part of the edge - so that the angle at the edge stays the same for the life of the razor.

Many people use tape when grinding a frown or chips out of the razor - so that it doesn't get 10 years worth of spine wear in 1 day. Personally, I'd rather have the better shaving narrow edge angle, and can live with the look of the spine wear.[/QUOTE]



Ever wonder why there is a controversy????

There ya go everything in red is all opinion with no basis in facts... With a lack of facts comes controversy pretty simple...

Apologies John but you did put it out there, so you should have expected a rebuttal

Originally Posted by Gibbs

I can see that tape will take the brunt of what a hone does to the spine. And since it is peeled off and discarded after honing, it would stand to reason that each successive honing will be with a fresh tape and the dimension of the spine should be exactly where they were last time.

Glen has told me that he uses it every time, no exceptions, save a Japanese design. My simple question is would it not benefit use from the very beginning, a NEW razor, and not an older vitage razor? And once you start that, using tape on the spine, you should use it every time thereafter or else you will hone further up the bevel creating a dual part bevel, am I right on that?

Yes and no, you are giving way to much power to the tape.. It just doesn't do enough for these kinds of claims...

1/2 of 1 degree is the average change for tape..
20 laps on a 4k equivalent hone eliminates that...

There is only opinion other than it protects the spine, that is NOT opinion use it if you so chose or don't use it if you so chose...

We are talking 1 layer of 3m #700 electrical tape when you start changing that then you start changing things, start putting 2-3-4-5- layers of tape on to achieve a lift, then things change that gets into Restoration techniques not honing...

I only use tape because I don't like the look of spine wear, that's it.

I've not noticed any difference in the shave between tape and no tape.

This is definitely one of those contentious topics and if you search back you'll see many many threads on it...!

With normal honing, the spine typically gets very little wear. Some folks use tape to improve the angle just that little bit to get an edge quicker. Some use it to help get an edge on what I consider substandard or problematic type razors like the new Timor or Fromm razors. Some use it to protect spines when honing Damascus Razors or fancy spine razors. Some use it to keep spine wear to a minimum when you need to repair a chip or damage in an edge. As indicated, this is really an area of personal preference.

The one thing about tape though is that when you have an old W&B Meatchopper Wedge with flattening in different places on both sides, one piece of tape or two will simply accentuate that damage and it will still be reflected in the edge. You can keep layering up on the tape. You can leave the tape off and try to take off enough metal to where the razor will sit flat on the hone again or you can do a rolling X which is probably going to be the easiest solution.

In many cases, when a new person is learning to hone, tape can be a detriment.

I think in the end, personal preference will continue to prevail.

Have fun,

Lynn

Well, Lynn, to somoeone like yourself or Glen, who have done tens of thousands of razors, normal will be to stop when you reach your objective in the stage your on. Whereas, someone new might not know STOP and keep honing, and honing and even though they have achived their desired edge for that grit of hone, they still keep going. That might cause excessive hone wear.

It's a nice option (tape) and when used judicially, should work just fine most of the time (opinion).

Black electrical tape seems a bit thick.

Why don't people use scotch tape? Water proof properties of electric tape?

I suppose the thickness only affects 1 degree afterall, but any thoughts?

I think you would wear through scotch tape pretty fast.

Originally Posted by drgreen

Black electrical tape seems a bit thick.

Why don't people use scotch tape? Water proof properties of electric tape?

I suppose the thickness only affects 1 degree afterall, but any thoughts?

O right, I didn't think of those who set bevels with lower grits etc. or harsher hones that give more hone wear.

I was thinking more of a general maintenance hone that is very fine grit, that's why I made that comment.

Originally Posted by drgreen

Black electrical tape seems a bit thick.

Why don't people use scotch tape? Water proof properties of electric tape?

I suppose the thickness only affects 1 degree afterall, but any thoughts?

If I use tape I do use 3m scotch electrical tape which is black. To me it doesn't seem thick
I don't care if its waterpoof, I care how fast it wears off. The math about the angle is very simple too.

Originally Posted by drgreen

Black electrical tape seems a bit thick.

Why don't people use scotch tape? Water proof properties of electric tape?

I suppose the thickness only affects 1 degree afterall, but any thoughts?

Working as a machinist years ago, I keep around instruments to measure such thickness of electrical tape. I pulled out the digital calipers and measured an electrical tape piece from the drawer here at work. It measures 0.007 inch. That would be seven thousandth of an inch, and since you only have one side touching at a time, it would not be combined, but only 0.007" total. The slight raise off the hone in relation to the thickness would be pretty small..REAL small. Electrical tape is pretty resilient, stretchy as such, and is flexible enough to bend around the spine and be on both sides rather easily. It's slightly more raise to a 4/8 razor than to one that is 6/8 or 7/8 though, due to the distance between the spine edge contact and the contact of the razor's cutting edge. However it's nearly not worth the worry, as the difference is almost unmeasurable.