Thread: My First Coticule

Hmm, that's interesting.
It looks that the bevel isn't joined. A coti typically is like 8-10000. And leave a bit of stria. I believe the inclusion is higher than the surface of the stone.
Have you tried the coti I sent ya, for any difference.
I too find that they don't feel sharp and as keen as coming off the 12K or Escher/ Thurigan, but still shave very well.

Originally Posted by Gasman

Not going very good with my Coti. I took a Sheffield razor that had a nice edge on it. Killed the edge and went to the 12K just to be sure it was as good as I could make it. Then went to the Coti on clean water. The first thing I noticed was the stone felt gritty. Not smooth like a finishing stone. Also every time it went past the line in the stone I could feel it. After about 10 - 15 laps I noticed it was no longer undercutting the water. HUH? I cleaned everything up, made sure my water was clean, Took my 1000dmt to the Coti and rinsed it off with running water. Tried again. After about an hour or so I still was not undercutting water. I could feel the line across the stone and it never seemed to be going well.
Here is what the edge looks like after aprox. 1.5 hours on the stone...

Sure dont look right to me. The scratches in the bevel are more than I get with the 12K and shouldn't it not look like this? Starting to wonder if the line in the stone is a flaw and is causing me issues.


Opinions? Now I not expecting to be a pro right off the get go but its just not feeling right to me.

I've only used slurry followed by clear water on my Coti. I loaned the Coti to a good friend and Pro Honer to test. I thought that I was getting some really nice edges but I wanted his experienced counsel.

He found it a good one and in fact had honed about 50 Sheffield blades on it for his customers. However at one end I have a very small bit of 'blue' peaking through the yellow. The Pro said it didn't seem to affect the edge but cautioned to try to stay away from it.

I found this very good news as the Coti was found, purchased and sent to me by a friend in Germany for $60 USD. Of course I immediately paid him in full.

Sometimes things go right for me.

I stropped it up and it feels sharp to the touch and I'll give it the shave test tonight.
Your stone felt smoother than this one, not counting the inclusion as you call it. Now I'm the first to say and understand I don't know anything about these stones but I'm starting to wonder about it. I sent these pics and an email the where I bought it to get there opinion too.
If its me than that's fine. I understand but... Just wanting others opinions. If I don't get anywhere in a few weeks I might be looking for a volunteer that hones on Coti's a lot and send it to them to play with for a while. Just an option I think.

Oh, And BTW, I had shaved with this razor before and got good shaves from it so I know the bevel was set well to start with. Maybe the pic makes it look funny or the Coti did something to it?

Sorry to hear this Jerry. I've been using mine for touch ups, like I used my Nani 12k and it seems to do a fine job.
Mine has no line in it though. I'm no pro with these so I really can't help you.
Just tossing in what mine has done.
And I use it under running water. Once in a while if I see a micro chip, I'll slurry it up and do a step down dilution

Hope you get it figured out my friend

That's what Im saying. If you are feeling it, it might be the problem.

Got a reply from thesuperiorshave and he asked if I felt it in one direction and not the other. Asked if I lapped it. I took it to the kitchen and gave it a go under running water and I do feel it in only one direction. Odd. Hadn't noticed that. And it dont feel like its in the line. Like in the bigger white splotch. I replied with this info and asked if I should lap it. Its flat and they lap them so I didn't think it really needed it.

It was nice to get a fast reply. I'f there is an issue I'd hope he would take it back for trade or something. I'm determined to learn the Coti! I'm just that way. Stubborn! LOL. Thanks for the reply's. I'll keep this going on what happens.

If possible try honing right up to the line like as if it's a shorter hone and see what that does. It might tell if the line is giving you issues

Originally Posted by Gasman

Not going very good with my Coti. I took a Sheffield razor that had a nice edge on it. Killed the edge and went to the 12K just to be sure it was as good as I could make it. Then went to the Coti on clean water. The first thing I noticed was the stone felt gritty. Not smooth like a finishing stone. Also every time it went past the line in the stone I could feel it. After about 10 - 15 laps I noticed it was no longer undercutting the water. HUH? I cleaned everything up, made sure my water was clean, Took my 1000dmt to the Coti and rinced it off with running water. Tried again. After about an hour or so I still was not undercutting water. I could feel the line across the stone and it never seemed to be going well.
Here is what the edge looks like after aprox. 1.5 hours on the stone...

Sure dont look right to me. The scratches in the bevel are more than I get with the 12K and shouldn't it not look like this? Starting to wonder if the line in the stone is a flaw and is causing me issues.

Opinions? Now I not expecting to be a pro right off the get go but its just not feeling right to me.

Surface feel (the gritty sensation you mention) says nothing about fineness or end result, in my experience. For example, I had a coticule that sounded like honing on gravel, but gave wonderfully smooth edges. I got rid of it because I found it uncomfortably large (5x20cm).

I'm not all that familiar with synthetics, but at least on coticules I found that a good edge on wedge-like grinds undercut water to maybe a mm beyond the bevel; the more hollow the grind, the further up the water travels.

1.5 hours seems...long. I don't want to say excessive, because if your stroke is clean, there's not much damage a coticule can do. It is, however, plenty of time to make costly mistakes.

By the way, if you try your hand at creating a secondary bevel (by adding a layer of tape), less is more; I'd advise against doing any more than 50 X-strokes.

Also, if your fingernail doesn't catch the line, I wouldn't worry about it too much.

Finally, the striations on your bevel seem in line with a coticule finish. I have one that leaves a shiny-ish bevel, but that stone is really slow. I can't remember the last time I used magnification, as the look of a bevel is pretty inconsequential when using a coticule, especially when using them pretty much exclusively.

Have a shave and see how it goes.

Best regards,

Pieter

Gasman, I reread your original post where you gave a description of the stone. Omitted is the stone’s grade, standard or select. Vein names are not important. I’m supposing with the inclusion and white splotch it is a standard grade stone. I know grade is not suppose to effect performance, but select grade stones are not suppose to have imperfections in them. So if it is the stone and Jarrod exchanges it, and he probably will, look to a select grade stone with no imperfections.

I'm pretty sure The Superior Shave only sells select grade coticules.

Standard grade coticules are also not supposed to have imperfections that are a negative influence on the honing result.

In effect, the difference between grades is aesthetics, and a faulty stone is a faulty stone either way.