Thread: Can stropping by itself make a razor pass the HHT?

Yes. All of my razors have passed the HHT after stropping only.


Scott

Originally Posted by honedright

Yes. All of my razors have passed the HHT after stropping only.


Scott

This revelation could mean the end to HAD and save more money than ridding the earth of the smallpox scourge. Scott, please share your technique

Originally Posted by alpinmack

I'm just wondering what the magic trick is. I can hone (Norton 4/8 K) and paddle strop (only 1.0 diamond at this point) my razor so that it cuts arm hairs really well but I just can't seem to get it HHT sharp. What is the deal? Will stropping make that much of a difference? Thanks.

You have two questions, with two answers:

First, the title of your post: "Can stropping by itself make a razor pass the HHT?". That leaves a wide open door - stropping can't take an ancient, pitted eBay special to shaving sharp, and there is a lot of degrees of sharp in between that need a hone to start with.

However, from the body of you post, it seems your primary question assumes a good honing base and wonders "Will stropping make that much of a difference?" Absolutely, with out a doubt, yes. I shave hairs from my arm with all my woodworking edge tools but they won't shave my face. There is still some distance between your very sharp honed edge and shaving sharp. Your pasted strop gets closer, but I suggest effective stropping on an unpasted strop takes it further. IMHO....and in my experience.

- Dale

Originally Posted by Bruce

This revelation could mean the end to HAD and save more money than ridding the earth of the smallpox scourge. Scott, please share your technique

Bruce -

My technique is based on the technique taught in barber manuals. A good example is the Milady Practice and Science of Standard Barbering by Thorpe. I posted some photos from the book in the "Stropping 101" thread showing the basic stropping pattern. This is the basic X pattern stropping.

What I do differently is, instead of using a purely straight stroke diagonally across the strop (it helps to see the photo), I sweep the razor in more of an arc. The razor still starts and ends in the same places on the strop, the path is just slightly different. Much of the movement is the forearm pivoting at the elbow. The upper arm remains relatively still.

I started doing this after watching a barber at my local shop strop one of his razors. I found that this method allowed for very fluid and rapid stropping.

The other factors involved are:
1) Focus pressure on the back of the razor keeping it in contact with the strop. This helps take pressure off of the edge preventing the "rolled" edge that others have mentioned.
2) I use my thumb at the edge of the razors mid shank to roll the razor back and forth and to control downward pressure of the razor against the strop.
3) Of course, keep the strop fairly taught. You don't need a death grip on the strop, but enough to take out all the slack.
4) Listen to and feel your razor while stropping. Others have mentioned this phenomenon. I don't think that there is any adequate way to teach this on an online forum. It's something that you will just have to be attentive to and develop over time. But there is a certain sound and feel that will tell you when you are stropping effectively.
5) Learn the Thumb Pad Test. There is sticky and then there is really sticky. And it's not just sticky that you are trying to feel. Even the barber manuals divide up the different types of sensations that can be detected when simply brushing the moistened thumb pad along the keen edge of the razor. You want a smooooth sticky. It's sort of sublime, almost zen like. Very difficult to pick up at first. It's something that really requires the presence of an experienced individual to show you. Then you would know immediately what it should feel like.
Of course you could just do shave tests as promoted by some of the more experienced members here. I find that a little too time consuming. I'd rather have a method that doesn't require first lathering up, then trying to shave, re-stropping, re-lathering, re-shaving, re-honing, etc, etc...
I've found that a razor that passes the TPT per the above will also pass the HHT with flying colors.

That's all I can think of for now regarding stropping technique. If I think of more, I'll be sure to add it.


Scott

Originally Posted by honedright

Bruce -
5) Learn the Thumb Pad Test. There is sticky and then there is really sticky. And it's not just sticky that you are trying to feel. Even the barber manuals divide up the different types of sensations that can be detected when simply brushing the moistened thumb pad along the keen edge of the razor. You want a smooooth sticky. It's sort of sublime, almost zen like. Very difficult to pick up at first. It's something that really requires the presence of an experienced individual to show you. Then you would know immediately what it should feel like.
Of course you could just do shave tests as promoted by some of the more experienced members here. I find that a little too time consuming. I'd rather have a method that doesn't require first lathering up, then trying to shave, re-stropping, re-lathering, re-shaving, re-honing, etc, etc...
I've found that a razor that passes the TPT per the above will also pass the HHT with flying colors.

That's all I can think of for now regarding stropping technique. If I think of more, I'll be sure to add it.
Scott

Just want to add that to do the TPT correctly, you either have to have woman hands or make sure your thumb is wet. Otherwise you will never get that "zen" like feeling. It feels like the razor is actually sucking into your thumb. Almost like a gravitational pull.

Originally Posted by Bruce

This revelation could mean the end to HAD and save more money than ridding the earth of the smallpox scourge. Scott, please share your technique

Ha, that'd be nice, wouldn't it.

+1 on Scott's (Hondright) point #2. Very good post Scott! I use the same elbow pivot described by Scott, that I also think is very important. After awhile you don't need edge testing. You just know the razor isn't any different than the last time you shaved with it.

Originally Posted by honedright

...

1) Focus pressure on the back of the razor keeping it in contact with the strop. This helps take pressure off of the edge preventing the "rolled" edge that others have mentioned.
...

Thanks Scott.

I'd add that in addition to preventing the rolled edge, this is a big help in learning consistency. It allows you to keep a firm enough pressure on the strop to control the process, while leaving the pressure light on the edge to get that extra fine edge.

I also echo the helpfulness of the sound and the TPT. All of this takes time, practice, and patience.

- Dale

Originally Posted by alpinmack

No. I'm one of those stubborn newbies who want to do it themselves. And yes, I've heard from everyone that I should have a perfect edge to start with. I know, but I still want to do for myself first. I guess that means I don't have a good excuse huh?

That's how I did it. If you manage to get a comfy shave with a razor that you honed you're in business regardless whether your blade is less sharp than your reference razor.

Scott,

Whatever way you move the razor across the leather, at the end of the day you have to remove metal to get a sharp edge. A stroke on the leather wil remove a minimal amount of metal compared to a stroke on the hone. If your razor isn't almost shave sharp it will take you ages to get it sharp with a strop only.

Last week it took me hours to hone out a hardly visible corroded section on the edge of a Puma (ebay special) using 1500 and 5000 grit Shaptons. That must take days of continuously stropping on leather unless it is pasted with coarse grit paste.

Originally Posted by honedright

Bruce -

My technique is based on the technique taught in barber manuals. A good example is the Milady Practice and Science of Standard Barbering by Thorpe. I posted some photos from the book in the "Stropping 101" thread showing the basic stropping pattern. This is the basic X pattern stropping.

What I do differently is, instead of using a purely straight stroke diagonally across the strop (it helps to see the photo), I sweep the razor in more of an arc. The razor still starts and ends in the same places on the strop, the path is just slightly different. Much of the movement is the forearm pivoting at the elbow. The upper arm remains relatively still.

I started doing this after watching a barber at my local shop strop one of his razors. I found that this method allowed for very fluid and rapid stropping.

The other factors involved are:
1) Focus pressure on the back of the razor keeping it in contact with the strop. This helps take pressure off of the edge preventing the "rolled" edge that others have mentioned.
2) I use my thumb at the edge of the razors mid shank to roll the razor back and forth and to control downward pressure of the razor against the strop.
3) Of course, keep the strop fairly taught. You don't need a death grip on the strop, but enough to take out all the slack.
4) Listen to and feel your razor while stropping. Others have mentioned this phenomenon. I don't think that there is any adequate way to teach this on an online forum. It's something that you will just have to be attentive to and develop over time. But there is a certain sound and feel that will tell you when you are stropping effectively.
5) Learn the Thumb Pad Test. There is sticky and then there is really sticky. And it's not just sticky that you are trying to feel. Even the barber manuals divide up the different types of sensations that can be detected when simply brushing the moistened thumb pad along the keen edge of the razor. You want a smooooth sticky. It's sort of sublime, almost zen like. Very difficult to pick up at first. It's something that really requires the presence of an experienced individual to show you. Then you would know immediately what it should feel like.
Of course you could just do shave tests as promoted by some of the more experienced members here. I find that a little too time consuming. I'd rather have a method that doesn't require first lathering up, then trying to shave, re-stropping, re-lathering, re-shaving, re-honing, etc, etc...
I've found that a razor that passes the TPT per the above will also pass the HHT with flying colors.

That's all I can think of for now regarding stropping technique. If I think of more, I'll be sure to add it.


Scott