Thread: ONE COTICULE HONING

Originally Posted by Dups

Well I like the idea of using only one thing to keep my razor sharp. I'm also not 100% sure that my skin appreciates the extra sharpness from the pastes. I have very sensitive skin.

dups I've tryed the dmt /bbw /yellow and i don't think the bbw totaly gets rid of those deep scratches and i have found the shaves are good but feel not as smooth as could be . may be because the dmt i have is still fairly new. I rather use my 4k then 8k bbw/yellow after setting bevel

I'm also guessing that using the coticule to set the bevel instead of the DMT leaves a nicer and cleaner bevel. What do you prefer, the DMT -BBW - Coticule or the One coticule honing system? It's going to be interesting to see how the edge on Bart's technique hold up compared to a normal bevel.

I think the dmt is great at setting bevels i like it better than my noton 1k if a rzor was realy bad then i'd use dmt. i try the coticule and if its not getting there quik enough but i mean taking for ages then i would use dmt. but what i'd do is get the bevel set with yellow and slowly dilue slurry down over 80 laps or so then finish on 100 light laps fresh water and i now use fresh bottled or filterd water because the water out of our taps can be hard with the lime in there just a greek guy gave me this tip and says it makes a differance. Then i strop on linen and leather i think the linen makes a differance. The shave i have found with this method can be very good if its not as good i then drop back to bbw sl then plain water and always gives a good smooth shave barts new method also works but me personaly i just don't like adding layers of tape i would rather just hone and have the normal bevel same as i don't like honing dry and have never tryed it. i must say honing with tape does feel a lot nicer on the hone.ch.5 is good stuff i like to think i can get shave ready of the hone but the truth is paste will probably always give that extra sharpness but should'nt be used to try and make up for not enough honing i'd feel like i am cheating my self.Also pressure on the belgiums play a big part and knowing how to keep your slurry right densaty always milky and misty looking seems to work to dense and you won't get that all important fine edge. You say you have sensative skin i no howard has sensative skin he finds bbw slurry and yellow slurry no water honing suits him (Milky light slurry.)I have tryed this and same again it does work i my self keep trying with and with out slurry and still tying to work what is the best result i don't think you can go wrong with bbwslu/yellow water just try all the differant ways.

I actually think I got a better shave using Bart's method of sticking with the coticule the whole way. Using the DMT -BBW- Coticule - Cr0 method was giving me a nice sharp edge but maybe too sharp for my skin. My razor doesn't pass the HHT as easily as it used too but the quality of the shave and the irritation free results afterward felt pretty darn good. Has anyone experienced this before and how long does a double bevel like this last compared to a normal single bevel?

Originally Posted by Dups

Hey Bart,
have you noticed that the razor needs more refreshing since the bevel is so small on it? How does it measure up to a normal bevel maintenance wise?

thanks,

JF

If anything, the edge could be a bit more durable, because the angle is a small bit obtuser. The width of the bevel faces is not directly connected to edge longevity. The dulling of a razor's edge happens in a sub-micron range. The width of the tip of a shaveable edge is 0.5 micron or less. If it deteriorates to 1 micron, it's probably already out of range. The secondary bevel we're talking about is (by estimation) in the 0.5 to 1 mm range. That's between 500 and 1000 micron.

Bart.

thanks! How many shaves do you usually get out of a razor like that before it needs to be refreshed or even completely redone...?

thanks!

Originally Posted by Dups

thanks! How many shaves do you usually get out of a razor like that before it needs to be refreshed or even completely redone...?

thanks!

Depending on the razor, between 15 and 30.
(that's a rough estimate).

Originally Posted by Dups

Hey Bart,

got a question for you. I was watching an old coticule video from LX_Emergency and I was curious if you knew what kind of slurry stone he might be using..It doesn't look like a coticule at all.

I just re-checked his video, and I don't know. I guess the only one to answer that question is Alex himself.

Originally Posted by pjrage

Another thing I was thinking about, completely not related to this duck, is stropping. Now, I haven't noticed any problems yet, but I wonder how stropping is affected by the double bevel? I know they say that since the strop has some give/flex, it should be ok, but I would be curious to see some before/after stropping edge shots to know for sure how much the edge is or isn't affected by the strop. I mean, with perfect stropping, the edge wouldn't be getting hit at all, right? By perfect I mean a very taught strop and very light perfect strokes. With imperfect stropping (more realistic), where the edge is in fact hit, wouldn't the very light abrasion of the linen/leather eventually round the point where the two bevels meet, resulting in a sort of rounded bevel (but not necessarily rounded edge) ?

I don't really share that vision on stropping.
For pasted stropping, I do agree that the abrasive surface should be as flat as possible. I recommend a paddle strop, or a loom strop at a taut setting for any pasted stropping.
But for daily stropping on clean leather or linen, I do think the slight slope in the strop is important. I does divert most of the strop's power to a very narrow strip at the very edge. (Doesn't it sound familiar? )

By the way: I believe about half the forum tapes the edge before honing and I don't think anyone reapplies the tape before each stropping session. That I tape halfway during honing, is not going to change much.

About the convex bevel and the double bevel being related to each other, I believe you are correct. But our double bevel is created with the edge leading, as opposed to the edge trailing motion of convex sharpening on pasted strops. Still, the reason why CrO pasted strops are so effective in boosting sharpness, is because they allow an extremely fine abrasive to work on a very narrow strip of steel. (even a paddle strop has enough cushion to introduce convexity).
The layer of tape, late in the honing process relies on the same principle, except that the transition is not gradual as in a convex shaped bevel, and without the disadvantages of edge-trailing abrasion.

Best regards.
Bart.

Originally Posted by BHChieftain

Just honed my Wacker 1/4 hollow razor with this method. Tried coticle + light slurry after the tape, didn't get arm hairs to pop, so moved to BBW + slurry. But maybe just more time with coticle + light slurry would have gotten me there-- I'll try that next time (note, my coticule is pretty hard--I can't scratch it with my fingernail, and it takes a while to get the slurry to turn grey). But, after the coticule + water and the strop, got a really nice HHT response for most of the blade (toe isn't responding-- my pressure must not be even). By far the best hone I've done so far.

-Chief

I just shaved with this razor today-- WOW! I'm sold...