Thread: Societal Norms Discussion

Canada, the UK and India (not for their senate I think though?) all use the same archaic FPTP (First Past the Post) parliamentary system. Whoever gets the most votes in a region takes the seat and everybody else's vote be damned. The Green Party takes about 500,000 votes every federal election, but never gets a seat. That's half a million Canadians whose votes are ignored. There is a growing MMPR (Mixed Model Proportional Representation) movement. That's basically New Zealand and Germany's government, in fact most democracies. This way we'd get local representation tempered by percentage of popular vote. It's easier than the Australian PV (Preferential Voting) system and arguably more 'fair'. The traditional parties have been resisting because the like the power of a majority government established by 25% of the potential voters. They have succeeded in convincing us that minority governments are unstable even though studies prove the exact opposite.

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We here in MI put up with the same thing it bugs me too. I like the system from I think LA? where they have run off elections eliminating the bottom vote getters each time until there is a majority winner. Sure beats it up here where the Gov was elected by a smaller margin than the votes of either of the two largest third parties.


Another societal thing is Ketchup. I can see why Aussies don't usually like it on fries/chips theres is way too runny with not enough salt. I love vinegar on fries but ketchup is great too.

MMPR is better than run offs and PV (essentially the same thing) IMHO.
What happens there is that each riding gets two seats and each voter usually gets two votes. Voters get to vote for their favourite candidate and their preferred party. Voters get the most popular candidate in any riding and whatever the popular vote percentage is for each party is achieved, usually from a party list, to fill the rest of the House. There's usually a bare minimum percentage like 2% to 5% of the popular vote to deserve a first seat and ridings tend to be a bit bigger to fit all the seats. That's smart for a multi party system.

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Belgium has a multiparty system.
every vote counts and at the end every party has a number of seats according to their result.

Then the king appoints someone whose job it is to start informal talks with each party to find out which coalitions are viable / possible.
Then the king hands that report to the leader of the largest party with the task to form a government.

Then there is a month or so of coalition talks in which the major policy decisions are decided upon between the colation partners.
In the end they put these decisions into a document, the different seats are divided based on the most logical person to occupy it (as agreed in the coaltion talks) and the king swears the government into office.

I got some remarks from GW earlier, but contrary to what you think, the king has no direct powers in Belgium and his job is largely ceremonial.
for example: a law is only a law if the king signs it, but he is required to do so.
There is one instance where the king declined (abortion law, king was a devout katholic)
He was then declared unfit to rule for one day, the law was passed and he was reinstated.

In short, we are ruled by a representative government, headed by a PM who is de facto the leadr of the largest party in the coalition.

EDIT:
I forgot to add that all eligible voters are required by law to turn up for the elections. You are not required to vote but you have to turn up. This law was originally created to prevent factory bosses from pressuring their personnel not to vote. 100 years ago, industrialists and nobility ruled supreme and having a law to force the people to turn up was the only way to break their hold on the election results.

Originally Posted by Jimbo

We also *have* to vote - we get fined if we don't, unless we have a good excuse. Sometimes the weirdest excuses are published.

James.

Did anyone ever use the excuse that they became violently nauseated, barfing their guts out all day while pondering the wretched excuses for politicians on the ballot? Or maybe that's just an American thing, LOL.

Originally Posted by PapaBull

Did anyone ever use the excuse that they became violently nauseated, barfing their guts out all day while pondering the wretched excuses for politicians on the ballot? Or maybe that's just an American thing, LOL.

So True!

-whatever

-Lou

Southern California is quickly turning into Belgium. This may be seen as an improvement to some, but it's not for me. This is why I'm selling my house and leaving as fast as I can. Before they make the state a sanctuary state for illegal aliens. Los Angeles is officially a sanctuary city, and quite frankly, I'm a little tired of paying for the education of children of illegal aliens as well as their free emergency room visits that have bankrupted 72 hospitals in the state (so far.) I want to live in a place where being homosexual (BTW it's NOT genetic, it's a choice) is still viewed as the perverse and pathetic lifestyle that it really is. I want to live where EVERYONE speaks English, the pledge of allegience has "one nation under God" in it, and where personal honor, integrity and responsibility are important. Some place where right and wrong is still right and wrong and not a function of some personal multiple choice buffet.

I know this place exists and this is where I'm moving to.

Originally Posted by mercV12

Southern California is quickly turning into Belgium. This may be seen as an improvement to some, but it's not for me. This is why I'm selling my house and leaving as fast as I can. Before they make the state a sanctuary state for illegal aliens. Los Angeles is officially a sanctuary city, and quite frankly, I'm a little tired of paying for the education of children of illegal aliens as well as their free emergency room visits that have bankrupted 72 hospitals in the state (so far.) I want to live in a place where being homosexual (BTW it's NOT genetic, it's a choice) is still viewed as the perverse and pathetic lifestyle that it really is. I want to live where EVERYONE speaks English, the pledge of allegience has "one nation under God" in it, and where personal honor, integrity and responsibility are important. Some place where right and wrong is still right and wrong and not a function of some personal multiple choice buffet.

I know this place exists and this is where I'm moving to.

I have no problem with right and wrong. But who are you to define them?
Why are your right and wrong better than my right and wrong?
Why is being homosexual perverse?
Do I have to believe in YOUR god in order to live in your nation? And if you allow for freedom of religion, which religions are right and which are wrong? And what do you do with atheists, muslims etc?

As long as other people treat me and others with respect, they can be gay, muslim, or anythingI am not.

EDIT: I don't mind discussing this further but let's extend each other the courtesy of being polite and not turning this into the next Joe vs Bill.

Ever notice that people always figure every one else should think like they do? Merc wants everyone to be Christian, heterosexual, English speaking people if they live in this country. Bruno wants everyone to be as liberal as he is regardless of where they live. It's just human nature.

One societal norm that cannot be escaped..... get into wide open discussions about religion or politics and suddenly people who got along just fine before are no longer friends.

Originally Posted by mercV12

I want to live in a place where being homosexual (BTW it's NOT genetic, it's a choice) is still viewed as the perverse and pathetic lifestyle that it really is. I want to live where EVERYONE speaks English, the pledge of allegience has "one nation under God" in it, and where personal honor, integrity and responsibility are important. Some place where right and wrong is still right and wrong and not a function of some personal multiple choice buffet.

I know this place exists and this is where I'm moving to.

We should all appreciate spaces where Homosexuality (which is NOT a "choice" (think about it, who would choose to be targeted and hated by homophobes)) and hateful statements like yours are not allowed ... oh wait! That's this very forum. I would respectfully ask you to immediately remove your hate speech from this forum. Just do it. It's the right thing to do.

I also want to live in a place with Freedom FROM Religion. You wouldn't want somebody else's idea of "God" enforced on you and I don't want yours forced on me, meaning I want to live somewhere where people are free to speak how and what they like (hate excepted) and where personal honor, integrity and responsibility are indeed important and not merely paid lip-service to.

I'm dreaming of a place where right and wrong are determined by their help or harm to a society and not individual or mob fears, where choice is permitted and supported. In short where narrow minded and, dare I say, Fascist ideals are not the order of the day.

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