Thread: McCain frightens me!!!

Originally Posted by toolarts

The way our system works, even if someone talented, intelligent, honest, and unbiased does get elected, they won't be able to do much.

Yep, people that know my political views thought ai was crazy hoping for ron paul in earlier stages, but I figured between his goals, and having to deal with congress something workable would come out.

Here are some words OF JOHN McCAIN:

"In all candor, we thought our civilian commanders were complete idiots who didn’t have the least notion of what it took to win the war."
McCain, Faith of My Fathers, pp. 185–186. ***

My question is, now that HE'S one of the Civilian Commanders, what's changed? Do today's Troops feel the same way about HIM?


He would later write, "I had learned what we all learned over there: Every man has his breaking point. I had reached mine."
Lieut. Commander John S. McCain III, United States Navy. "How the POW's Fought Back", U.S. News & World Report, 1973-05-14 ***

Doesn't McCain say that Torture doesn't work? It appears to have worked on HIM! Which story is true? Did Torture work on John McCain, or doesn't it work? He CANNOT have it BOTH ways!
Another thing scares me about McCain. I have watched both versions of THE MANCHURIAN CANDIDATE. The one that starred Frank Sinatra and the newer one, with Denzel Washngton. I am not sure that the John McCain who was shot down, is the SAME John McCain who's running for President.

One more thing...
McCain graduated from the Naval Academy in 1958; he was fifth from the bottom in class rank, 894th out of 899. ***

The cited information (***) above came from Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_McCain

Originally Posted by Brother Jeeter

Here are some words OF JOHN McCAIN:

"In all candor, we thought our civilian commanders were complete idiots who didn’t have the least notion of what it took to win the war."
McCain, Faith of My Fathers, pp. 185–186. ***

My question is, now that HE'S one of the Civilian Commanders, what's changed? Do today's Troops feel the same way about HIM?


He would later write, "I had learned what we all learned over there: Every man has his breaking point. I had reached mine."
Lieut. Commander John S. McCain III, United States Navy. "How the POW's Fought Back", U.S. News & World Report, 1973-05-14 ***

Doesn't McCain say that Torture doesn't work? It appears to have worked on HIM! Which story is true? Did Torture work on John McCain, or doesn't it work? He CANNOT have it BOTH ways!
Another thing scares me about McCain. I have watched both versions of THE MANCHURIAN CANDIDATE. The one that starred Frank Sinatra and the newer one, with Denzel Washngton. I am not sure that the John McCain who was shot down, is the SAME John McCain who's running for President.

One more thing...
McCain graduated from the Naval Academy in 1958; he was fifth from the bottom in class rank, 894th out of 899. ***

The cited information (***) above came from Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_McCain

I was thinking the same thing but didn't dare say it out loud!

Originally Posted by Brother Jeeter

Here are some words OF JOHN McCAIN:

"In all candor, we thought our civilian commanders were complete idiots who didn’t have the least notion of what it took to win the war."
McCain, Faith of My Fathers, pp. 185–186. ***

My question is, now that HE'S one of the Civilian Commanders, what's changed? Do today's Troops feel the same way about HIM?


He would later write, "I had learned what we all learned over there: Every man has his breaking point. I had reached mine."
Lieut. Commander John S. McCain III, United States Navy. "How the POW's Fought Back", U.S. News & World Report, 1973-05-14 ***

Doesn't McCain say that Torture doesn't work? It appears to have worked on HIM! Which story is true? Did Torture work on John McCain, or doesn't it work? He CANNOT have it BOTH ways!
Another thing scares me about McCain. I have watched both versions of THE MANCHURIAN CANDIDATE. The one that starred Frank Sinatra and the newer one, with Denzel Washngton. I am not sure that the John McCain who was shot down, is the SAME John McCain who's running for President.

One more thing...
McCain graduated from the Naval Academy in 1958; he was fifth from the bottom in class rank, 894th out of 899. ***

The cited information (***) above came from Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_McCain

This is one of the reasons I voted for him. Complicated issues- and life in general, cannot always be tied up into pretty little simple packages. I appreciate the fact that he can be honest without worrying about how his sound-byte will sound. I trust that he'll do his best to keep from making the same mistakes made in the 60s and more recently.

As for torture, I think what he meant when he said it doesn't work is that you won't get good intel from it. You'll hear what you want to hear from the person being tortured, not necessarily the truth.

I should hope he was changed by his experience as a POW. I said earlier if you come through that and lead a positive life, you had been changed and made "better". Tempered, if you will.

Who cares what his class rank was. That was long time ago. For what its worth, Jimmy Carter graduated 59th out of 820 at Annapolis. How good a president was he?

BTW, this has been a very civilized discussion so far and I appreciate it.



Jordan

I little off-topic but on C-span the other day, McCain's mother was interviewed --- I think she is about 93 years old or so --- a very impressive lady, sharp, and forward. I was thinking she should run for president ------ but she was one of the best advertisements for McCain that I've seen so far.

Justin

As for torture, I think what he meant when he said it doesn't work is that you won't get good intel from it. You'll hear what you want to hear from the person being tortured, not necessarily the truth.
Jninch67

###Jordan, I am convinced that if I don't care whether a man lives until tomorrow morning, I can find out ANYTHING he EVER knew.

I should hope he was changed by his experience as a POW. I said earlier if you come through that and lead a positive life, you had been changed and made "better". Tempered, if you will.
Jninch67

###I am sure that an experience like being a POW and surviving Torture DOES change a person irrevocably, forever. The extent of that change and exactly what the changes were, is of GREAT concern to me, when we are discussing a Presidential Candidate.

Who cares what his class rank was. That was long time ago. For what its worth, Jimmy Carter graduated 59th out of 820 at Annapolis. How good a president was he?
Jninch67

###Jimmy Carter was abysmal! I completely understand that everyone can't graduate number 1. But I would hope that the President was at least in the top half of his class. The position he occupied in the Graduating Class is a reflection of his ability / desire to excel / and level of endeavor, AT THAT TIME.
I am not trying to smear McCain. There are some serious questions I would like to have answered, before I even contemplate voting for him. Since there is NO way I am going to get an answer to those questions, I will HAVE to vote for another Candidate!

You have to look at the facts- not your feelings. I generally don't get involved in these discussions either, but this is one time when I realize the outcome of this election will have far reaching consequences.

Alot is said about every candidate, except Huckabee and Paul- they are just "Also Ran's" They have zero chance of party nomination and they know that.
The race is between Obama (a no experience, no policy, no platform, no stance until he knows how you want him to stand nobody), Hilary (a closet Socialist), McCain (liberal disguised as a Republican) and Romney (an honest to goodness business man...with issues).

This entire race so far has been a case of self important people who thought people liked and respected them.

I'm in MA- We (somehow) elected an "Obama" for governor and are paying for it! Patrick is useless and has already undermined the fiscal gains and corrections Romney made in his term. Romney took a state with lots of Pork projects, high taxes, big deficit, and big government and balanced the budget, eliminated the deficit, killed the pork and brought growth. Patrick's first act as gov was to spend money! (new office furniture and a Cadillac since the state owned Lincoln wasn't good enough).
Everyone I know in the State government says the same thing- Patrick's inexperience and poor judgment is very evident. Do you want THAT in the White House?!
(Incidentally, no one in this state knows how Teddy keeps getting elected either- I don't know anyone who knows anyone who votes for him!)

McCain is a war hero. I thank him for his service to his country- but that has absolutely nothing to do with his policies, views, platform, or voting record.
He's not really "a Republican that is willing to reach across the isle"- if you actually look at the bills he co-authored (that this refers to) and his voting record on all items, he's more like a Democrat that's sitting on the wrong side.

The only Conservative view he has is not pulling out of Iraq like we did in Viet Nam. He wants open borders, Amnesty, allowing the UN to influence US Foreign policy, and Socialized health care and has absolutely no policies or experience with domestic policy.

Hilary may as well just come out and say it- she's a socialist. (look up socialism before arguing)

Romney is a business man. He has seen what open borders and illegals have done to my state and had his hands tied on immigration here. (We did have several raids in hot spots while he was in office!!) His views and platform is conservative and HE is electable. If you want to know about the disaster that is the health care system look in my state. Look at the free care clinics in the emergency rooms waisting resources instead of treating emergency patients. Look at the huge numbers of illegals in the waiting rooms. Look at the illegals refusing to be discharged from the hospital until after lunch so they can eat! (I have personally seen it- all of it!)

The only answers that will preserve the Sovereignty, security, and longevity of the USA are securing it's borders, enforcing it's borders, actively deporting ALL illegals, and cutting unnecessary government spending. Think about it for the long run. And yes, I personally would gladly pay higher taxes if the government was actively enforcing border security AND Deporting illegals.


Those that fail to learn from history, are doomed to repeat it. - Winston Churchill

The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.
Winston Churchill quote

Everyone has his day and some days last longer than others.
Winston Churchill

Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts.

Originally Posted by Justme-

You have to look at the facts- not your feelings. I generally don't get involved in these discussions either, but this is one time when I realize the outcome of this election will have far reaching consequences.

Alot is said about every candidate, except Huckabee and Paul- they are just "Also Ran's" They have zero chance of party nomination and they know that.
The race is between Obama (a no experience, no policy, no platform, no stance until he knows how you want him to stand nobody), Hilary (a closet Socialist), McCain (liberal disguised as a Republican) and Romney (an honest to goodness business man...with issues).

This entire race so far has been a case of self important people who thought people liked and respected them.

I'm in MA- We (somehow) elected an "Obama" for governor and are paying for it! Patrick is useless and has already undermined the fiscal gains and corrections Romney made in his term. Romney took a state with lots of Pork projects, high taxes, big deficit, and big government and balanced the budget, eliminated the deficit, killed the pork and brought growth. Patrick's first act as gov was to spend money! (new office furniture and a Cadillac since the state owned Lincoln wasn't good enough).
Everyone I know in the State government says the same thing- Patrick's inexperience and poor judgment is very evident. Do you want THAT in the White House?!
(Incidentally, no one in this state knows how Teddy keeps getting elected either- I don't know anyone who knows anyone who votes for him!)

McCain is a war hero. I thank him for his service to his country- but that has absolutely nothing to do with his policies, views, platform, or voting record.
He's not really "a Republican that is willing to reach across the isle"- if you actually look at the bills he co-authored (that this refers to) and his voting record on all items, he's more like a Democrat that's sitting on the wrong side.

The only Conservative view he has is not pulling out of Iraq like we did in Viet Nam. He wants open borders, Amnesty, allowing the UN to influence US Foreign policy, and Socialized health care and has absolutely no policies or experience with domestic policy.

Hilary may as well just come out and say it- she's a socialist. (look up socialism before arguing)

Romney is a business man. He has seen what open borders and illegals have done to my state and had his hands tied on immigration here. (We did have several raids in hot spots while he was in office!!) His views and platform is conservative and HE is electable. If you want to know about the disaster that is the health care system look in my state. Look at the free care clinics in the emergency rooms waisting resources instead of treating emergency patients. Look at the huge numbers of illegals in the waiting rooms. Look at the illegals refusing to be discharged from the hospital until after lunch so they can eat! (I have personally seen it- all of it!)

The only answers that will preserve the Sovereignty, security, and longevity of the USA are securing it's borders, enforcing it's borders, actively deporting ALL illegals, and cutting unnecessary government spending. Think about it for the long run. And yes, I personally would gladly pay higher taxes if the government was actively enforcing border security AND Deporting illegals.


Those that fail to learn from history, are doomed to repeat it. - Winston Churchill

The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.
Winston Churchill quote

Everyone has his day and some days last longer than others.
Winston Churchill

Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts.

Well you should -- that was very good.

Justin

Jeeze, just from that I'm going to be looking into Romney a little more

Originally Posted by jockeys

I'll tell you what scares me:

A LITTLE HISTORY QUIZ
It's just a short one, only 6 questions.If you don't know the answer
make your best guess. You don't need paper or anything. Answer all the
questions before looking at the answers.

Who said it?

1) "We're going to take things away from you on behalf of the common
good."
A . Karl Marx
B. Adolph Hitler
C. Joseph Stalin
D. None of the above

2) "It's time for a new beginning, for an end to government of the
few, by the few, and for the few...and to replace it with shared
responsibility for shared prosperity."
A. Lenin
B. Mussolini
C. Idi Amin
D. None of the Above

3) "(We)...can't just let business as usual go on, and that means
something has to be taken away from some people."
A. Nikita Khrushev
B. Josef Goebbels
C. Boris Yeltsin
D. None of the above

4) "We have to build a political consensus and that requires people to
give up a little bit of their own...in order to create this common
ground."
A. Mao Tse Dong
B. Hugo Chavez
C. Kim Jong Il
D. None of the above

5) "I certainly think the free-market has failed."
A.Karl Marx
B. Lenin
C. Molotov
D. None of the above

6) "I think it's time to send a clear message to what has become the
most profitable sector in (the) entire economy that they are being watched."
A. Pinochet
B. Milosevic
C.Saddam Hussein
D. None of the above

Answers:
(1) D. None of the above. Statement was made by Hillary Clinton
6/29/2004
(2) D. None of the above. Statement was made by Hillary Clinton
5/29/2007
(3) D. None of the above. Statement was made by Hillary Clinton
6/4/2007
(4) D. None of the above. Statement was made by Hillary Clinton
6/4/2007
(5) D. None of the above. Statement was made by Hillary Clinton
6/4/2007
(6 ) D. None of the above. Statement was made by Hillary Clinton
9/2/2005


You scared yet?

What scares me is that people believe this
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/221/
Here's a link to the polical "truth meter" about this "pants on fire"(off the scale lie) email. I would suggest a little browsing of that non-profit, NON-PARTISON website. I must admit it did ease my mind a bit about McCain's "Manchurian Candidate" reputation. The fact is that ever since his release McCain has squashed any attempts he could to locate any remaining POW, MIAs.
Also as much as I hate to agree with that fountain of misinformation Rush Limbaugh, I must admit that Barack Hussein Obama's middle name and Muslim heritage give me the chills with what's going on in the world right now.