Thread: Shaving and Orthodox Judaism story

Highly orthodox Jews are intolerant because they see themselves as the only true jews and don't even recognize others as being jewish. Most outside their sect view them as religious nuts.

As far as less orthodox jews being intolerant here in the U.S that has pretty much gone by the wayside except for the religious sects. The reason being that if everyone intermarries eventually there will be no more jews or that's what they are afraid of.

Originally Posted by majurey

Not just Orthodox. My wife is Jewish (her parents were members of a Reform synagogue when they lived in the UK). It took me a long time to earn their trust and respect so that, ultimately, they could stomach the idea of their youngest daughter marrying out.

She must have been very much in love with you to have put up with what must have been a very stressful situation for all that time. Congratulations. Since your wife is Jewish, that means your children are also. Are you raising them Jewish? My family never accepted the fact that I married out and have, literally, treated me as if were dead. I have had no contact with them for about 13-14 years.

Originally Posted by Chimensch

She must have been very much in love with you to have put up with what must have been a very stressful situation for all that time. Congratulations. Since your wife is Jewish, that means your children are also. Are you raising them Jewish? My family never accepted the fact that I married out and have, literally, treated me as if were dead. I have had no contact with them for about 13-14 years.

Is this why you are so self hating, and why you harbour such a grudge against Israel and the Jewish people as a whole??

Originally Posted by Englishgent

Is this why you are so self hating, and why you harbour such a grudge against Israel and the Jewish people as a whole??

I was wondering the same thing myself!

Originally Posted by Englishgent

Is this why you are so self hating, and why you harbour such a grudge against Israel and the Jewish people as a whole??

No, I don't hate myself or the Jewish people as a whole. Israel will be judged by the world for what it does.

The concept of self-hating is very strange. If a white southerner, in the 1960s, said that whites were racist, he would be stating a fact, not hating himself. If an American said that the US is committing war crimes, as many do, would you call him a self-hating American?

Anyone who has studied any Talmud at all, knows that, at its core, Judaism is a racist religion. Anyone who looks closely at the legal structure of Israel can see that it's an apartheid state. I didn't write the Talmud and I don't run the state of Israel, so why should I hate myself? Because I know the difference between right and wrong?

"Self-hating Jew" and "Antisemite" are two words that Jews use to shut up their critics without having to think very much. There are a lot of people in the world who are upset with what Israel is doing and that don't even know me. What you seem to be implying is that a Jew who doesn't fall into line with the propaganda of the tribe must be psychologically disturbed. I guess that's what the lemmings say about the ones who won't jump over the cliff (see the second quote in my signature line).

Originally Posted by JMS

I was wondering the same thing myself!

JMS, every sentence you write ends with an exclamation point! You must be a very emphatic person!

You and Englishgent are similar in the sense that one believes that the Jews can do no wrong and the other believes that Americans can do no wrong. I would rather see the world as it is than swallow lies. It's a better survival strategy in the long-run.

Originally Posted by Chimensch

JMS, every sentence you write ends with an exclamation point! You must be a very emphatic person!

You and Englishgent are similar in the sense that one believes that the Jews can do no wrong and the other believes that Americans can do no wrong. I would rather see the world as it is than swallow lies. It's a better survival strategy in the long-run.

Methinks you assume too much!
As far as exclamation points, its a habit I never broke myself of and get plenty of grief for!!!

Chimensch, I have a question if you are willing to answer.

what sort of blade is used for circumcision, and isn't it a single blade?

Originally Posted by Chimensch

She must have been very much in love with you to have put up with what must have been a very stressful situation for all that time. Congratulations. Since your wife is Jewish, that means your children are also. Are you raising them Jewish? My family never accepted the fact that I married out and have, literally, treated me as if were dead. I have had no contact with them for about 13-14 years.

Yes, we were young (me 19, she 20) and we did go through a lot of stress. I'm very lucky she was strong and stood up for me and our relationship. 20 years on and our two kids are 6 and 3. My son was circumcised (the bris was probably the most difficult thing I have had to endure). My relief at having a girl second time around (especially as we were told to expect a boy at the scan) was huge. But now at 6 we're faced with the conundrum of whether to send him to Hebrew School on Sundays, to eventually prepare him for his Bar Mitzvah. It's crunch time again.

You see, I finally have a problem with this. If we sent him to lessons, it would be for the benefit of his grandparents (my in-laws), since [1] I am an agnostic, and [2] my wife is not an observant Jew. It would be merely to appease my in-laws. That doesn't make it wrong necessarily (it's both about an individual's belief as well as the wider family's beliefs), but it puts me in a very difficult position with my children.

For example, he will be taught stuff I just don't believe. How will I reconcile that with him in discussions at such a young age. "Why don't you believe in God, Dad? My teacher says... etc." And the killer in my mind "If you don't believe in this, why are you sending me to Hebrew school every Sunday?" There's so many shades of grey here it's overawing.

Ignoring the issue won't make it go away. The day will come when my in-laws will wonder what the hell we're doing to prepare for his Bar Mitzvah, and the coming of age for a boy is still regarded as a big thing even amongst Jews who are not particularly observant. My wife still believes it's an important social tradition (I would probably agree given that the concept of a ritual to mark the coming of age for young men is hardly specific to Judaism!).

Ach, sorry, I've gone way OT and in danger of !

Oy vay.

Originally Posted by JMS

Chimensch, I have a question if you are willing to answer.

what sort of blade is used for circumcision, and isn't it a single blade?

Other than my own, I've only attended one circumcision and I really couldn't stand to look too closely but I thought it was a surgeon's scalpel.