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Thread: Possible Brisbane and SE Qld meet up

  1. #161
    Senior Member Maladroit's Avatar
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    Hi Andrew,

    glad you're throwing your hat in - it was a long time between drinks for the last 2 meetups!

    With regard to your hone buying dilemma, my on-paper preference (for whatever it's worth) would be for a selection of the Shapton glass stones over anything else. I've seen them in action at the wood shows, as well as Lynn's video of the 1000 as a bevel setter, and I'm pretty impressed. They don't dish at anything like the rate of water stones and there is the advantage of no coloured and staining residue, such as some of the Chosera and Naniwa stones produce. I'm now on the verge of buying a 1000 Shapton GS as a bevel setter as I'm sick of constantly having to flatten my King 1000 - besides, the King is a great stone for chef's knives and I'd like to dedicate mine to that task.

    BTW, I'm seriously looking forward to putting a blade over the Esher - as I imagine several others are too - I can see a queue forming

    Last thought: one of the benefits of owning an Esher is that you wouldn't have to buy the Shapton 16000 - a pretty expensive stone - instead, you could just buy the 1000, 4000 and 8000. One more thing: a big advantage of the Shapton 4000 and 8000 over the Norton 4k/8k combo is that they're good to go from day one, that is you don't have to spend hours carving a mm or more off the 4000 before it's ready to use, as you would probably have to do with the Norton 4k - see many threads on this forum for advice on this.

    regards
    Mike
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  2. #162
    Senior Member AndrewJM's Avatar
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    Thanks Mike, thats great feedback.

    I do like the idea of a stone that doesn't need flattening, and I had never considered the staining effect of Naniwas. I didn't see any shapton glass stones at the meetup, so assumed that the general consensus was that other options are better, or that the shaptons didn't feel good to use... I read a couple of things about the shaptons, and many suggested they were harsh stones to use?

    What do you mean by "They don't dish at anything like the rate of water stones"? I haven't heard the terminology "dish" before.

    Re the escher: everyone is welcome to have a play and bring any razors they want to run over it. I dont have much knowledge to share, but I am happy to share anything I buy.

    So, no lapping required with shaptons? Is that just out of the box, or for the life of the shapton?

  3. #163
    Senior Member Maladroit's Avatar
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    "dishing" is the effect where from use a hone gets worn preferentially in the centre, i.e. "dished". Relatively soft matrix hones such as synthetic waterstones exhibit this effect in spades. Crystalon (or silicon carbide) stones used for knives also do this whereas the aluminium oxide hones (also used for knives) are more or less immune because of their extreme hardness - they're not very good for razors as the grit rating is seldom high enough - although I have set bevels on a 400 India AlOx oil stone. Hard natural Japanese or Arkansas rocks are also slow wearers and don't need frequent flattening.

    I doubt that Shapton glass stones need much flattening out of the box and my general impression is that a periodic pass over a DMT is all that is needed to keep them flat. Shapton sell a hideously expensive diamond flattening plate but a DMT is probably fine. I'd be keen to hear other opinions on this.

    Mike
    Last edited by Maladroit; 03-05-2014 at 11:45 AM. Reason: grammar

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  5. #164
    Senior Member AndrewJM's Avatar
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    Thanks Mike

    I have been reading through this entire thread again, making sure I have everyone's name right (I'm bad with names), and realised... wow, I talk a lot. Sorry guys. Almost half this thread is me asking you questions lol. The problem is, the more I read on this site, the more I want to know. Really appreciate everyone's patience with me

  6. #165
    Senior Member blabbermouth edhewitt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AndrewJM View Post
    Thanks Mike

    I have been reading through this entire thread again, making sure I have everyone's name right (I'm bad with names), and realised... wow, I talk a lot. Sorry guys. Almost half this thread is me asking you questions lol. The problem is, the more I read on this site, the more I want to know. Really appreciate everyone's patience with me
    Dont worry about the questions, you will get to a point where you ask less and answer more, but there will always be things you want an opinion on. Looks like you had a good day, and am glad you had fun.
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    Bread and water can so easily become tea and toast

  7. #166
    Senior Member AndrewJM's Avatar
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    Shame you weren't there Ed, would have been nice to meet you in person also.
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  8. #167
    The Great & Powerful Oz onimaru55's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maladroit View Post
    I doubt that Shapton glass stones need much flattening out of the box and my general impression is that a periodic pass over a DMT is all that is needed to keep them flat. Shapton sell a hideously expensive diamond flattening plate but a DMT is probably fine. I'd be keen to hear other opinions on this.
    All stones need 'some' flattening from new but yes a DMT C or an Atoma 400-1200, take your pick, will do just fine.

    The Shapton GS is one of the most consistent & foolproof stones there is for razors & can double for other work. So from Japan-Tool recommends no other synthetic for razors.
    I find the Shapton Pro dishes even less than the GS but the Pros are a more aggressive stone & I don't recommend them to the new guys. The GS is more forgiving & also gives a better polish.

    The GS is like chalk & cheese cf. Kings. I made that jump a few years ago too.
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  10. #168
    Senior Member Maladroit's Avatar
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    I think I need no further convincing: a Shapton GS 1000 is definitely in my sights.

    Interesting to hear about the Shapton Pro hones - I have a 12000 which I use as my top finisher - it certainly cuts more aggressively than a Chinese Guangxi stone (the "PHIG") but all the better for that I have no experience with the lower grit Pros and on Oz's advice I'll probably leave them alone for the time being. I'll stick with the Norton 4/8 for my intermediate work.

  11. #169
    Bladesmith by Knight Adam G.'s Avatar
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    Hi Andrew,
    awesome afternoon, and yes. Put me down for the next meet.
    Stones, well the experts said it. I still reckon a natural is awesome for a finisher, but to do all honing on naturals you have to be willing to hone a hell of a lot of razors to learn your stones inside out. All naturalsare different.
    the reason I went Naniwa over Shapton was purely cost. Naniwa are a bit cheaper. SRD have the 3 stone combo for $175USD. Just two Shaptons cost almost that. Just depends on your budget
    looking forward to our next meet.
    Adam
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  12. #170
    Senior Member Havachat45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AndrewJM View Post
    Thanks Mike

    I have been reading through this entire thread again, making sure I have everyone's name right (I'm bad with names), and realised... wow, I talk a lot. Sorry guys. Almost half this thread is me asking you questions lol. The problem is, the more I read on this site, the more I want to know. Really appreciate everyone's patience with me

    That's the way it is in the early stages of your journey, Andrew - we've all been there and have met with the same gentlemanly attitude from older members - that's how skills and knowledge are passed on.
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    Hang on and enjoy the ride...

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