Thread: Lemmings

You know, those little furry animals that follow each other over the cliff every so many years. Ask them why they do it. Hey, I'm just following the guy in front of me!

So why do we each follow the shaving traditions you know, the hanging hair test, the thumbnail test, the pyramid for honing, X pattern, shaving prep techniques and on and on.

Do we do all these things because we know they succeed or because someone told me to do it and he has 899 posts here and it says he's a honemeister and he was told it by some mystical shaving guru who learned it from some old barber. Hey, if everyone uses the x pattern it must be the only way, right?

Ever wonder how much of this stuff would ever pass a scientific analysis and how much is just one mans road to shaving nirvana?

My point here is that all the tests and techniques in the world have only relative value and at best are just starting points to substitute for the lack of experience and each person must find his own way and adapt his own methods of doing things to be successful. There is no cookie cutter formula to success or freeway to shaving bliss.

What do you think?

Part of the reason people follow tradition is most of the lessons were learned from the mistakes over a hundred years ago. By following traditions, we don't necessarily have to make the same mistakes. This doesn't mean things should not be up for test/analysis/debate, but there's no real point in reinventing the wheel.

There are no shortcuts because there is no end. Experience is the best teacher. You have to learn what works for you. Maybe it's the size of the razor, or the point, or the prep, or the pastes, etc. etc. Everyone eventually finds their groove. But it is their groove, not mine. My input may help serve as a navigational point on the map, but the journey is their own. I can show you the way to climb the mountain, but I cannot climb it for you.

All things should be approached with what we call "beginner's mind" in the martial arts. As soon as you think you know something, you cease learning about it. It's a danerous trap that applies to every facet of our lives. Learn from everyone. Learn what works for them and why. Hold nothing as a sacred gospel truth, because many times it just isn't so.

As for the road to nirvana... well, it begins with your first shave with a straight razor. Each shave after that is just a step in the journey.

Certain things are just that. Traditions that seemed to have worked for one person.
We HOPE they will work for us just as well and that's why we try them. Some of them we go against and develope a new tradition for ourselves but such things take time.

I usually listen to the advice of the guy ahead of me, try what he says and then decide if it works. Then it'll become part of my tool kit. The biggest problem I've found isn't the advice but the narrative. Some guys give more descriptive info or a better description.

The only parts that have bothered me were pressure related. Most guys on here talk about "pressure" with the word "light" associated with it EVERY single time. It took me forever to get a good shave with that advice. Its not wrong, just incomplete. When I studied the barbers manual and the term "light" isn't in the book even once it felt wierd, sortof of like betrayal or something. To this day I get my best shaves when I follow the advice in the barbers manual and blow off everything said on here about pressure. The ideas aren't contradictory, just different descriptive words for the same ideas. To hone, use either twice the wieght of the blade or just the wieght of the blade, THATS NOT LIGHT. To strop, use enough pressure to feel a draw, THATS NOT LIGHT EITHER.

I'm still convinced not one of you knows how to strop correctly. :-)

So, yea, I've had atleast one period when I had my best improvement when I stopped listening and just learned it for myself. And even the videos are useless, since you can't tell what someone is doing, feeling, or thinking and replicating the action is usually way bad "advice"

I always had 2 learning methods that I chose to follow for pretty much every task that I learned to do:
1) Just wing it and figure something out. That worked for computer repair and drywall but not for dancing.
2) Do what someone who knows what he is doing is doing. Once I learned it well enough to get satisfactory results, I'd experiment and develop my unique style. That worked for driving, martial arts and essay writing (the basics I learned in grade 9 gave me amazing results in university). This is the method I decided to follow with SRs.
A smart person learns from his own mistakes. A wise person learns from others' mistakes. Sometimes I wish I had more wisdom lol.

Lemming! Well, I never...

I feel more like a toad, hopping from one lillypad of advice to another.


Emil

Can't fault your honing guide/blog .. I used it as ref; again last night . I was full of confidence , I had the guide - the tools and the razors ...........and I'm still useless with that Norton !!!!! I ended up going back to Tilly's Gem hone and my Carborundum and for the first time ever one of my razors glided over the top of my arm hair taking anything that stood in it's way with no effort and it passed the HHT ( tnx to my good lady for the contribution of hair ) . The same razor gave that loud rasping sound on the strop - I was like a kid in a candy shop , sadly I didn't have time to test shave at 04:40 this morning .....
Think what I'm getting too is -- The theory on how to achieve a razor sharp blade has been provided to me ( by yourself and others ) and the results are also they're it's that bid in the bloomin middle I need to find

The advice given here is always meant with the best of intentions. It is also not the only way of "skinning the cat".
Experimenting with the different variables will teach each one of us something and will frequently lead you back to the tried and true. The men who came before us were just as inquisitive and intelligent as we are. To assume otherwise is pure foolishness. I have been dismayed that we have so few written resources available to us. Some barbers books and some old monographs and the great website put up by Arthur Boone.

What we are doing here will really be the basis for a lot of people in the future. The knowledge and ideas posted here will be summarized and put into a variety of different formats that others will use for many years.

Bill Ellis has really been a good example of this. His "Big Dipper" razor is an excellent example of thinking outside the box.
Chris Moss really experimented with the abrasive pastes and helped us all learn from that. Booga carried that even further.
Robert Williams (Papabull) has developed the paper towel test. Lynn Abrams developed the Pyramid system. Bill Ellis and Vlad contributed significantly to restoring a razor.

Lemmings? I think not,

There is certainly real value to standing on the shoulders of those who have spent many years in the art of straight-razor shaving. Re-inventing the wheel as a newcomer can probably lead to pain and disaster, both of which are only fun when sharp razors are not involved. On the other hand, blindly following advice without developing an understanding of the purpose behind it can hurt.

Building on the fundamentals is essential in any venture. From there, you can determine which approach, method, technique, and application best meets your needs.

Originally Posted by AFDavis11

I'm still convinced not one of you knows how to strop correctly. :-)

You've got a point there Allan. More time spent learning and discussing this basic skill would make a world of difference for many members who are new to the art, IMHO. The best demonstration I've seen of how to use a strop is on the Greg Ives' (Master Barber) video _The Lost Art of Straight Razor Shaving_ available here:

( http://users.mikrotec.com/rebel23/wwwpages/index.htm ).

Hal