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Thread: First time honing - questions...

  1. #31
    pcm
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    H
    Quote Originally Posted by Euclid440 View Post
    Looks good, but there is some pitting on the bevel and above the bevel, did this razor have Cell Rot or heavy pitting? If so, you may have trouble getting it to hold an edge.

    Move on the the 4k and refine the edge, use tape on the spine. Most of the pitting on the bevel and edge should hone away. At 8k you edge should get very straight and chip free.
    Had to look up cell rot. No, there is no rust on the blade at all to indicate any celluloid rot. Should I increase to two layers of tape at 4k and 8k? If so, is the idea to have a double bevel, or something else? (trying to understand this)

    Should I do X strokes at 4k and then on 8k, or should I do a pyramid? If former, how do I know when to advance from 4k to 8k?

    Thanks for the guidance!
    Regards,

    PCM

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  3. #32
    pcm
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    OK. I put on two layers of tape and did 60 circles at 4K, then 100 X strokes, and then did a 10/10, 5/5, 3/3, 1/3, 1/5 pyramid with the 4K and 8K. It is cutting arm hair pretty good. I'll strop and give it a try tomorrow, just to see what it feels like.

    With this two layers of take there is a double bevel now. Should I be doing more strokes, until there is only one bevel?

    When should I consider advancing to the 12K? How many strokes should I consider?

    Here are some shots before doing the progression:

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    and then after the progression:

    Name:  150727195423318.jpg
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    It's hard to get the edge in focus...any little movement blurs it a bit. I did do the sharpness tests from that video. No wire edge on any reflection from side or straight on.

    Regards,
    Regards,

    PCM

  4. #33
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    I did a shave test this morning, after stropping 25x on CR-OX webbing, 50x on cloth, 100x on leather. Did an entire shave, and it was great! Very little irritation. Seemed to cut well, with no pulling. Shave was very close. Very pleased!

    Questions:

    1) Should I hone more, to get the bevel to a single bevel (versus the double bevel I have now)? Using the 4k?

    2) Should I proceed to use the 12K? If so, what type of stroke and how many?

    3) In general, how does one know, when to go from 4K to 8K and 8K to 12K?

    4) This blade (a 1/4 wedge) doesn't give as much feedback, and doesn't seem to pull (or have resistance) as much as my (new) full hollow Boker that has about 20 shaves on it. Is it because the Boker is starting to dull, because of the nature of a full hollow, combination of the two, or something else?

    5) I have used CR-OX a few times on the Boker. Can't say I notice much difference. Is that due to number of strokes I do (25), the fact that the Cr-Ox is on webbing, or maybe the amount of Cr-Ox on the strop? I now have a 3" cloth strop - would it be worthwhile to put Cr-Ox on the back of that?

    I haven't really figured out yet, how to deal with blades that are starting to lose their sharpness. The Spike was the first blade that needed work, due to dings. The Boker is the first that I've used for a while and haven't sharpened (although I have one coupon for sharpening it). Any suggestions on how to handle maintenance would be appreciated!

    Regards,
    Regards,

    PCM

  5. #34
    Senior Member blabbermouth
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    Your edge was not coming together, either the steel is bad, you are not doing enough laps, using too much pressure, used a low grit aggressive stone early on, or you need more angle. The easiest one to do is another layer of tape.

    You can hone a new single bevel on a 1 or 4k or just keep the double bevel. All that counts is the edge. You could have set a whole new bevel with the 4k with a few more laps.

    There does appear to be a lot of small pitting on the razor and that often leads to chippy edges, a steeper angle can solve that sometimes, and less pressure.

    When the 8k removes all the 4k stria, move to the 12k, it looks pretty good now; any 1 or 4k stria will show up after the 12k.

    What is the long horizontal stria in the 2nd photo from?

    That is why folks like wedges, the extra weight makes a difference in the shave.

    Chrome Oxide should smooth and add a bit of keenness to an edge, it could be the Chrome Oxide or your substrate, try pasting a piece of cardboard, like the inside of a cereal box and doing 10-15 laps with lite pressure. Is the Chrome Oxide, razor quality?

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  7. #35
    Senior Member blabbermouth
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    Use an X stroke on the 12k until all the 8k stria is removed, use light pressure, then finish, stropping on Chrome Oxide. Check the edge to make sure it is not chipping, if it does, you have to go down in grit or do more laps and try to remove all chipping.

    Maintenance depends on what is wrong with the edge. If it is just dull from shaving and or stropping, (one missed stroke can kill an edge) sometimes just proper stropping or stropping on paste can revive it. .50 or .25 Diamond is good for that. If the edge is chipped from hitting something, usually it will need stone work.

    Start on your 12k with some circles, and see if you can remove the chip and smooth with some X strokes. If 40 circles will not do it, drop down to an 8K. If it is a big chip, sometimes starting over and doing a complete bevel set, is time well spent.

    Most razors I get in for honing, have chips, so I usually try to bevel set with a 4k, I if I cannot remove all the chip and reset the bevel in 21 laps, I go to a 1k and work it up. If the chips are large, or impact damaged, I go straight to reshaping the edge on a diamond plate or file and reset on a 1k.

    There is no, one size fits all answer, you do what the edge needs. I always start with the least aggressive and drop down in grit to get the job done. For most, stropping is the cause of razor dulling, as your stropping improves, so too will your edges and they will last much longer.

    It is really not that complicated, remember for hundreds of years many maintained razors with a, linen and leather strop, maybe some chalk or lamp black soot and a small, 6-8k ish stone.
    Last edited by Euclid440; 07-29-2015 at 01:37 AM.

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  9. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Euclid440 View Post
    Your edge was not coming together, either the steel is bad, you are not doing enough laps, using too much pressure, used a low grit aggressive stone early on, or you need more angle. The easiest one to do is another layer of tape.

    You can hone a new single bevel on a 1 or 4k or just keep the double bevel. All that counts is the edge. You could have set a whole new bevel with the 4k with a few more laps.
    As soon as I get a chance, I'll try to do more on the 4K to get a single bevel.


    Quote Originally Posted by Euclid440 View Post
    There does appear to be a lot of small pitting on the razor and that often leads to chippy edges, a steeper angle can solve that sometimes, and less pressure.

    When the 8k removes all the 4k stria, move to the 12k, it looks pretty good now; any 1 or 4k stria will show up after the 12k.

    What is the long horizontal stria in the 2nd photo from?
    Gotcha. Thanks. I'm not sure what that groove is on the third shot. I didn't notice that before, when checking the blade, but it is there and is about 5mm long. At the beginning of the last cycle, I did circles with the 4k. Could it have been something on the stone?

    Quote Originally Posted by Euclid440 View Post
    That is why folks like wedges, the extra weight makes a difference in the shave.

    Chrome Oxide should smooth and add a bit of keenness to an edge, it could be the Chrome Oxide or your substrate, try pasting a piece of cardboard, like the inside of a cereal box and doing 10-15 laps with lite pressure. Is the Chrome Oxide, razor quality?
    Yes, I think so. The one on that strop is from another member, who had extra. It says 0.5 micron, made by HandAmerican. I also have some 0.3 micron from Glenn, when I bought a bench strop, but I haven't applied it anywhere yet.


    Regards,
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    Regards,

    PCM

  10. #37
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    Great Advice! Thank you!
    Regards,

    PCM

  11. #38
    Senior Member blabbermouth
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    Your chrome Oxide should be good then. I find a fine weave Nylon works better than a rough weave. Leather, Paper and canvas work well with Chrome Oxide, even wood, a 5 gal paint stir stick makes a quick strop.
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