Thread: 8000 DMT or Norton 4000/8000?

I was looking at getting a hone. The Norton 4000/8000 seems to be popular, but I was also looking at the 8000 DMT diamond hone. I like the idea of never needing to lap. Would the 8k DMT suffice as a single hone for a while?

Originally Posted by Jezza

I was looking at getting a hone. The Norton 4000/8000 seems to be popular, but I was also looking at the 8000 DMT diamond hone. I like the idea of never needing to lap. Would the 8k DMT suffice as a single hone for a while?

provided that you break the hone in properly first and your razor is already sharp it will work.

as to how to break in the gone... hone some good steel on it for a while... use light pressure and work the whole hone this will help minimize any possible aberrations in your hone and will render ti useful for a razor.

the way... a nice cold chisel worked for me polished up just fine.

the 4k/8k would be more useful though if you get a ding or nick in the blade.

others will be by shortly with different suggestions.

I don't have a DMT D8EE, but I call on all those that do and have used them:

Honestly, does it really "cut like a 4000 and polish like an 8000"?

Clearly that wasn't a marketing tag that DMT floated out there, and I don't remember if I read that line on B&B or here, but SOMEONE said that. Was it Joel at B&B in a review?

.......Is it really true? You can do decent edge work on a Norton 4000. Can the D8EE match the Norton 4000 in cutting ability? I'd like to lay this truth or hype to rest.

Thanks.

Chris L

Don't trust me. I honed my first taped razor tonight.
I really like the way it felt though, throughout bevel to polish on my shaps

That's the main thing with individual tastes. How does it feel? Do you like it?

I don't think you'll ever know if you like it until you have choices, I mean different stones from which to choose.

I will tell you I don't know a lot about razors either, like which ones are very hard steel, which ones not so much. I don't know what kind of stones you have either, or your level of experience. Tell us that and you'll get far better advice.

However, diamond stones will abrade metal, much faster than any other material - natural or man made, and dmt's are pretty good ones. Diamonds do break down with use and the hone becomes finer with long use, while other synthetics are friable and keep their rating--everything in sharpening is a trade off

When I first decided to commit myself to jumping into this with both feet my friend forum member JBHoren had been at it awhile. He had the Norton set of 1K,4/8 and flattening stone. He sold them to me and got the DMT series of diamond plates from coarse through extra fine. He hones his many razors with them and is very happy with the results he is getting.

I was happy with the Nortons until the HAD contagion got in my blood and now I have an assortment of natural and synthetic stones. My only experience with the diamond plates is the D8C for lapping and the D8E for setting bevels and removing chips. They do an excellent job for that purpose.

I am glad that I started with the Norton 4/8. As most fellows here say it is a good stone for a beginner giving perceptable feedback and great results. I still have my Nortons and I still use them sometimes depending the the razor. I recommend the Norton 4/8 and maybe the D8E to set bevels and double as a lapping plate. The D8C would be better for the lapping but the 1200 would serve the purpose and save buying yet another plate.

The Norton is a proven performer for str8 razors that can handle a variety of razors. The DMT line up is still being sorted out by the SRP guys.
That means that some of us are not sure which DMT to use for removing old oxidised edges and nicks, which for the bevel setting that usually is done by the Norton 4000 etc.

Don't get me wrong, the DMT are very effective and good quality. Its just that a lot of us know the Norton hones and can give advice about their use in a specific situation.

Personally, I do not use diamond hones on str8 razors anymore. I feel they are to harsh on the brittle razor steel.

Just my two cents,

Personally,
I think you can do so, but like Randy said, most of the advice here is for the Norton hone.
That said, I loved my D8EE (DMT 8000) it does indeed cut fast and leave a pretty smooth edge quickly. It also is nearly indestructible and needs no soaking. I think mine (along with some razors etc. I'd rather have kept) is in the one box that got lost by the movers last June when I moved to Virginia.
I've even used it (it's slow) to lap my coticule hones once, but probably you are better using a coarser grit hone for that purpose unless you have a bit of time on your hands.

Both hones do a good job, IMHO, it's just a matter of what features you want, I guess.
John P.

Originally Posted by Chrisl

I don't have a DMT D8EE, but I call on all those that do and have used them:

Honestly, does it really "cut like a 4000 and polish like an 8000"?

Clearly that wasn't a marketing tag that DMT floated out there, and I don't remember if I read that line on B&B or here, but SOMEONE said that. Was it Joel at B&B in a review?

.......Is it really true? You can do decent edge work on a Norton 4000. Can the D8EE match the Norton 4000 in cutting ability? I'd like to lay this truth or hype to rest.

Thanks.

Chris L

Yeah, I think Joel was the first to say that. And yes, it's true.

The D8EE (8k DMT) will remove metal as fast, or faster, than the norton 4k but it does so with 8k grit diamonds. I routinely go from using heavy pressure on the 1k DMT to the 8k and the scratches are gone in ~20 strokes.

I have found the DMT's to be indispensible in my razorsmithing endeavors. One blade that I did as a tester was just barely tempered to remove the internal stresses; it's final hardness had to be Rc 62+, maybe as high as 64 (usual razors are 58-61, the hardest any steel can be is 66-67) and it honed up just the same as any razor on the DMT's.

You do have to get used to the different feeling, but breaking them in by lapping a few stones or honing some sacrificial steel on them makes the feeling a lot better.

They do well for the usual honing needs as well but really should be paired with a finishing stone like a Thuringian, Coticule, Chinese 12k etc. But a pasted strop would suffice if you want to keep things simple.

You definitely HAVE to break in these hones! WHen I first tried one without breaking in it tore up my edge pretty good. After breaking it in, it works liek a charm.

Take the flat back of a chisel and run it back and forth on the hone for a few minutes with light pressure until the finish on the back of the chisel is nice and smooth (throw some water on there while you're at it). When you first start you will see it looking very scratchy. Keep going until the finish is nice and even.

Originally Posted by Russel Baldridge

Yeah, I think Joel was the first to say that. And yes, it's true.

The D8EE (8k DMT) will remove metal as fast, or faster, than the norton 4k but it does so with 8k grit diamonds. I routinely go from using heavy pressure on the 1k DMT to the 8k and the scratches are gone in ~20 strokes.

I have found the DMT's to be indispensible in my razorsmithing endeavors. One blade that I did as a tester was just barely tempered to remove the internal stresses; it's final hardness had to be Rc 62+, maybe as high as 64 (usual razors are 58-61, the hardest any steel can be is 66-67) and it honed up just the same as any razor on the DMT's.

You do have to get used to the different feeling, but breaking them in by lapping a few stones or honing some sacrificial steel on them makes the feeling a lot better.

They do well for the usual honing needs as well but really should be paired with a finishing stone like a Thuringian, Coticule, Chinese 12k etc. a pasted strop would suffice if you want to keep things simple.

Thanks Russel:

I'm really surprised there hasn't been more advocacy from the D8EE owners to recommend that newbies buy ONE STONE (the D8EE) rather than the Norton since a finishing stone is practically necessary after either.

Even though I owned a D8C and D8E and sold both when I went Shapton, believe it or not, I'm contemplating buying some DMTs again. Not for razors, but for lapping and honing wood chisels. I have down to 500 grit on the Shapton, but anyone who's lapped the factory grinding marks off of new chisel faces would agree, a DMT D8C would work just super for that and save a ton of time.

Chris L