Thread: Some questions I haven't seen answered yet

Oh, i am by no means a Vet! I've got a long ways ahead of me before i could say that!

I appreciate the input gugi.

My reasons for the number of strokes is somewhat logicical in my perspective. Being a beginner, it wasn't too long ago that i was in daflorc's position, and i have come to realize that the biggest problem i faced a month ago was assessing the edge - in fact, i'm still learning about it. It is my understanding that, on belgian hones, it is difficult to over-hone.
By suggesting that particular number, i estimated that you could conservatively assert that the resulting edge (assuming no miss-strokes or damage to the razor) would yield something akin to a shave ready edge. This would take miss-assessing the edge during the process out of the equation. by the end of it you'll have a confident base line with which you can compare future assessments. It's (in my opinion of course) the next best thing to having a shave-ready razor honed by someone like lynn.

On synthetics you can simply back down to the previous grit and then progress back to a finer grit should you not have established an appropriate bevel. of course you run the risk of over-honing, but you'll know. On a BBW once you dilute, it's somewhat hard to go back withought starting over- because there are no definite grit equivilents, nor can you measure slurry concentration. It's all by feel, and how can you judge by feel without experience or even a base-line? I spent weeks honing, diluting too early, then starting over, only to have recently achieved an actual base-line, and now i can hone a razor much more consistently and quickly now that i can assess when it is time to dilute.

Again, all i have posted is my opinion and suggestion, not fact. I definitely would not suggest doing anything with that rather nice dovo. Why would you if you can have something else for $10.

Besides, being a beginner myself and having done everything i posted myself, i can tell you that even if you fudge up and do everything over and over you won't kill a vintage razor. I've even done the exact same thing on my new la dressante bout natural combo bout with a vintage german 1/2 hollow, and i don't see any unreasonable wear. On both it's BBW and the coti side which is significantly faster.

Basically what i'm saying is, even if my method proves completely wrong and horrible, the consequences aren't disasterous and life-threatening. It really is essentially the "dilublue" that dr. ralfson posted over at the coticule cafeteria, except i added a bevel correction step (dovo factory edge), and another set of x-strokes at another level of slurry that i found beneficial.
I started out too timid with the BBW when i started. then i read dr. ralfson's post and thought that doing 300+ strokes was crazy. but then i did it and saw such an improvement over my own timid efforts i thought i'd pass it along and save a few weeks of half-success.

To the Original Poster........

1. Where are you located? Perhaps there is someone in your area you could meet up with for some honing demonstration/guidance?

2. Frankly, you should start with a 1000 grit wet/dry sandpaper, used wet, to start that bevel. 50-100 roundtrip laps should do it. Then move on to the BBW if you wish.

PM with contact info sent.

Originally Posted by randydance062449

To the Original Poster........

1. Where are you located? Perhaps there is someone in your area you could meet up with for some honing demonstration/guidance?

2. Frankly, you should start with a 1000 grit wet/dry sandpaper, used wet, to start that bevel. 50-100 roundtrip laps should do it. Then move on to the BBW if you wish.

PM with contact info sent.

thanks for that,

That's a good idea!

*I have a* a dublduck satinedge that is, well, far gone. the scales look to be melted together and warped more than anything i've ever seen; the blade is rusted so much that it feels more like a growth (ridges of rust!), and the edge is thoroughly rusted and densely chipped like a hacksaw blade. I would have just closed my eyes and hit it with a coarse stone, but all my DMT plates are in for customer service.

I tried on the last piece of 1k i had left. i think i'll have to go pick up something coarser.
- watch your fingers and the edge of the paper! Wet/dry gives papercuts like you would not believe!

How many people are the original poster in this thread and how many razors are we talking about?

I could have sworn this thread started with a shaving razor that couldn't be updated, and it was all the fault of the guys who hone razors professionally at Dovo.

If I didn't know better I'd swear I heard a tinge of sarcasm there

Originally Posted by daflorc

btw, I bought such a large stone because a 3 inch wide stone seems to make it much easier to keep the edge flat on the stone, and I can just set the razor on it and basically push it forward from behind.

Nothing wrong with a 3" stone. Most naturals are less wide. As soon as you acquire a taste for naturals or vintage barber hones (as most of us have) you'll have to learn how to use narrower hones.

I'm sure you're right. Since I bought that 10x3 BBW I've been on these threads trying to justify going that route instead of a coticule, and it seems I made the wrong choice?
I thought the BBW would suit my needs better because I already have a nice finishing hone, and need a rougher rock at the moment. I heard the BBW is 4,000 grit or so, (and I like the size) but I've since learned (thanks to SRP) that a coticule will still cut faster, even though it's 8,000 grit, for various reasons. I'm a little disappointed with that knowledge. Mainly because I'm greedy and want the nicest toys I can afford. (Can't have a ferrari, but I CAN have a bad-ass hone and razor)

Originally Posted by daflorc

I'm sure you're right. Since I bought that 10x3 BBW I've been on these threads trying to justify going that route instead of a coticule, and it seems I made the wrong choice?
I thought the BBW would suit my needs better because I already have a nice finishing hone, and need a rougher rock at the moment. I heard the BBW is 4,000 grit or so, (and I like the size) but I've since learned (thanks to SRP) that a coticule will still cut faster, even though it's 8,000 grit, for various reasons. I'm a little disappointed with that knowledge. Mainly because I'm greedy and want the nicest toys I can afford. (Can't have a ferrari, but I CAN have a bad-ass hone and razor)

You have just discovered the problem of a forum...

You are disappointed and you haven't even honed a razor or shaved with a properly honed blade...

That is where to much information is a bad thing... Now if you are in the CONUS send me the razor, I will hone it to a shave ready condition for you, for free, on a Select Grade Coticule...

Then learn to shave for a few weeks or months, Then learn to hone after that, with a razor that has a proper bevel set...

Just PM me if you want to do this... Not in the CONUS PM me anyway, I bet I can find you somebody to hone that for you...

PS: There really is no grit rating on natural stone there are just a bunch of opinions on what they relate too
Heck the grit ratings on synthetics only relate to other stones of the same series

@daflorc,

Forums are very tricky. Members post their opinions. Most of the discussions are about advanced techniques. As a newb you should be concerned with the basics.

The basics of honing are in the wiki. I cannot stress too often how important it is to get to grips with the basics.

Here's the basics of honing: Beginner's Guide to Honing - Straight Razor Place Wiki. Take it from there.

Alas, gentleman, don't think I do not appreciate the offers of free honing services, and the repeated posts to focus on the beginner's guide to honing and using a razor.

As we all got into this hobby for our own reasons, let me explain to you mine, as it may help you understand my motivations when next I ask your advice (and surely I will be asking your advice on random and obscure razor/hone knowledge for quite a while)

I like the idea of owning "the best" razor, "the best" hone, the best sunglasses, etc. I get intrinsic joy from that, because while I can't own other nice things (car, house, helicopter) I sure as hell can afford a couple hundred bucks on a rock and razor. I also like the idea of sharpening my own blades, and (eventually) shave with them.

That being said, I don't care if I grind 3 razors down to the nub in the process of learning to hone, and I don't care if a coticule is 10 times harder to learn honing on than a norton, I want the coticule because I want the coticule. I want a big stone because they're easier for me, and rarer. And if I have to shave on a disposable Bic until I figure it out, I have no problem with that.

I am aware that I am not following the beginner's creed, and worrying about things that men at my learning level should not worry about, but I consider myself a rather quick study, and believe that with dedication and a continued self-education I will no doubt master this new hobby. Finding SRP was a huge gift, as is the input of other men who participate in this intriguing past-time, as you just cannot find such quality, personalized feedback elsewhere.

I suppose you could compare me to my stubborn 3 yr old son who won't take no for an answer and just HAS to do it on his own, which is sometimes the hard way, but nevertheless always his own way