Thread: Some questions I haven't seen answered yet

The problem with wanting to do all of the honing from the begining without having an already shave ready razor is that you have absolutely nothing to base it on. I can hone a razor to where it shaves and shaves well, but it doesn't come close to the sharpness and smoothness as that first razor I had professionally honed. I can always go back to that razor to see how close I am and where I need more work.

I think an example, shave ready razor, makes for a nice training tool to see what a well honed razor looks like, particularly under a microscope. But, the poster has placed a line in the sand and I respect that.

I still hope you take some time to evaluate the spine geometry, even if you intend to tear into the blade with a 4-6K stone. I think statistically you have a greater than 50/50 shot of success.

If I had to hone razors for the rest of my life with either a Coticule or a BBW, I think I would just give up and go back to a Gillette.

I learnt how to hone without a reference shave-ready razor. You know when you're there: when the shave is comfortable. When the razor lets you shave the hairs off your arm along the entire length of the edge without you having to apply pressure on the skin you're there. A shave-ready razor is only a yardstick, it won't steepen your learning curve.

I agree. It's possible to learn to home with a BBW/coti and no shave ready razor as a benchmark.

It's also easier to learn with a norton 4/8k and a benchmark.

If you want to go down the first path rather than the second, that's fine. But expect it to take you longer to get the results you want and to run into more problems along the way.

It just depends on what you want out of the hobby. But don't get into what's the "best" razor or hone, down that road lies madness...!

I read it somewhere and it's true:
People Change for Their Reasons, Not Yours

You can give a person a thousand reasons why they should do something differently, or better, or smarter, or cheaper... But if none of those reasons aren't one of their reasons they will likely not make a change.

=>Article by Lawrence J Cipolla<=

--Shoki

Originally Posted by daflorc

That being said, I don't care if I grind 3 razors down to the nub in the process of learning to hone, and I don't care if a coticule is 10 times harder to learn honing on than a norton, I want the coticule because I want the coticule. I want a big stone because they're easier for me, and rarer. And if I have to shave on a disposable Bic until I figure it out, I have no problem with that.

That's an approach, it'll work eventually, and with the hones you have you won't grind even one razor down to a nub. The problem is that your hone is on the very slow side and since there is just a bunch of garnets of all kinds of sizes floating around in a slurry your controls are quite imperfect.
There certainly is more than enough in this thread to get you going. I certainly agree with randy that sandpaper is a good way to start the process. It cuts deeper than virtually any hone at the same grit rating and you have to be very light with the strokes, but it's a fast way to get to a single bevel (and you're not sharpening until that point).

Originally Posted by daflorc

I heard the BBW is 4,000 grit or so, (and I like the size) but I've since learned (thanks to SRP) that a coticule will still cut faster, even though it's 8,000 grit, for various reasons.

Yes, the grit sizes on natural hones are just meaningless made up numbers. The sizes of the cutting particles are determined during crystallization of the molten rock and there is a wide range of them. In a man made hones those particles are sorted so only a very narrow range of sizes ends into the hone.
Then the surrounding matrix has just as much of an impact as the size, shape, and hardness of the cutting particles themselves, that's one of the reasons why BBWs are generally much slower than coticules.

thanks guys. I'll be honing on that big BBW tomorrow, (with maybe 1,000 grit sandpaper glued on flat wood) or possibly a heavy, muddy slurry (if I'm feeling know-it-all-ish and am ready to spend 3 hrs on it) and I'll let y'all know how it goes, if I have questions, or (cross my fingers) success!

Originally Posted by HNSB

Sorry to say that your eBay strop probably isn't helping matters for you.

There are good budget strops out there, but the ones from eBay aren't them...

Just curious, but why do you say the eBay cheap strops are no good? I am fairly new to SR shaving and purchased a cheapo strop from eBay because I knew I would nick it up while learning to strop, which I did. So farI have had good results with it, as my razor is still quite sharp and able to pass the hanging hair test, but I must admit that I have no idea how much better an expensive strop can be. Also, I occasionally use a balsa strop with chromium and iron oxides.

Originally Posted by daflorc

thanks guys. I'll be honing on that big BBW tomorrow, (with maybe 1,000 grit sandpaper glued on flat wood) or possibly a heavy, muddy slurry (if I'm feeling know-it-all-ish and am ready to spend 3 hrs on it) and I'll let y'all know how it goes, if I have questions, or (cross my fingers) success!

Lapping paper is often taped to a glass plate. Advantages are the extra weight and absolute flatness.

Originally Posted by BeltFed80

Just curious, but why do you say the eBay cheap strops are no good? I am fairly new to SR shaving and purchased a cheapo strop from eBay because I knew I would nick it up while learning to strop, which I did. So farI have had good results with it, as my razor is still quite sharp and able to pass the hanging hair test, but I must admit that I have no idea how much better an expensive strop can be. Also, I occasionally use a balsa strop with chromium and iron oxides.

You got lucky. You've could've ended up with five other strops that were not any better than stropping on a brick.