Thread: Sleeving or filling an oversized pivot hole

Originally Posted by gssixgun

in factIi probably could have done three in the time it took to do the math, just slip in a sleeve and be done with it, or do the epoxy thing, either works

haha right on!

Originally Posted by mainaman

the fix is to use a 1/8 " brass tubing, sleeve it on the next size down (OD=0.096"), and then use the regular 1/16 rod.
I have not used the epoxy method so I can't comment.

I use the brass tubing (found mine at Hobby Lobby) over my 1/16" rod as well for an oversized hole.

Has anyone ever tried using copper tubing instead of brass? I can't believe in a city of this size, I could not find 1/16" brass rod, nor can I find brass tubing. I wound up having to order the brass rod and just got it in this last week. I wish I would have ordered some tubing with it. Any way, I was able to find some copper tubing in the right size. Is there any reason why I shouldn't use the copper?

Thanks!

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Ok I'll explain,

These older Sheffields were actually punched instead of drilled, or so the story goes IIRC Alex found that out for us...
They were not that big when they were punched if you look closely you will find that the irregular hole has worn over the years, because it is "irregular" and had the slop to begin with... You need to take apart a few NOS 100+ year old razors to learn this fact, and that is the problem there are just not to many of them out there, so most of what you see is the effect of all that wear and tear...
These holes should never be tight but they also should not be so loose as they allow slop...
You can leave it, there are no rules here, but leaving it allows slop to creep into your system so later down the line don't be surprised when the blade starts to hit things.. Just starting out it also allows the pin to bend way easier too, so yes it does behoove you to fix it while you have it apart...

As always the choice is with the restorer... we can only post what we have found to be the best fixes we have found so far to date...

My personal rule of thumb is, if I can fit the sleeve in there, it needs one, but that is JMHO....

I should also point out the opposite fix too, that you could also just use a larger pin....

I have seen Case, DD, etc with round drilled holes. Not quite 100+ years old. I say drilled because it looks like it; but it could be punched but not in the way it was done 150+ years ago.

Every one I have seen with oversize irregular holes were punched.
Not nos, original scales or at least contemporary to the style of blade.

How many hundreds of times must that razor have been re-pinned if we assume the size of the hole has been enlarged with wear.

No the work-hardened pin will not abrade the hard steel. Unless modified by some unknown tinker, for unknown reason(s) at an unknown time, the hole as you see it must be the way it was made. It any of that is untrue, I just don't know.

maybe the punch wore and was reshaped until someone said[ whoa the hole are getting too crazy!

Dude, Kevin said it is fine that way, just leave it be...

Max, Alex, Stefan, Brad, Matt, Dan, myself and every other restorer that fixes them is wasting our time apparently... sorry for the bother, that floppy sloppy stuff is good to go...
How very very stupid of all of us for trying to fix these things...

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Dude, Kevin said it is fine that way, just leave it be...

Max, Alex, Stefan, Brad, Matt, Dan, myself and every other restorer that fixes them is wasting our time apparently... sorry for the bother, that floppy sloppy stuff is good to go...
How very very stupid of all of us for trying to fix these things...

Originally Posted by Maximilian

I've had a few of those. Tubes won't really work. Drill out the hole and then use a sleeve (or not) or leave as is.

I get your sarcasm Glen, but then Max posts this...? (Maybe I just didn't get his sarcasm.)

Anyway, I still figure there's no point in skipping a 5 second fix after spending hours (and hours) cleaning and scaling a razor. Anything worth doing is worth doing well, and besides, not doing a sleeve or some type of fix is going to make the razor much more difficult when you hone, strop or shave with it.

Not really being sarcastic, we take the time to not only post threads of how we do things, and explain why we do it, but to actually take pics, and do videos in some cases.... So someone might take the time to say "Yeah, why would you fix it" ????

Yeah I am not really being sarcastic in the least...

Now you might also take the time to read what Max is saying too, he is talking about fixing irregular holes that won't fit the tube with out drilling (which not everyone has a drill press) and talking about fixing crooked holes that would add stress if you sleeve it....

Honest we can't diagnose everything over the Internet even though we try..We cant see if the hole is crooked from here...We don't know if it is going to stress the scales through the screen...But we still try and give all of you our best guess anyway and take the time to address every issue we can think of...

You need to understand why we take the time out to explain all this, it is because we actually enjoy the hobby that much, and would love for everyone else too also...

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Not really being sarcastic, we take the time to not only post threads of how we do things, and explain why we do it, but to actually take pics, and do videos in some cases.... So someone might take the time to say "Yeah, why would you fix it" ????

Yeah I am not really being sarcastic in the least...

Now you might also take the time to read what Max is saying too, he is talking about fixing irregular holes that won't fit the tube with out drilling (which not everyone has a drill press) and talking about fixing crooked holes that would add stress if you sleeve it....

You need to understand why we take the time out to explain all this, it is because we actually enjoy the hobby that much, and would love for everyone else too also...

regardless of how you choose to embellish, the contemporary method of choice was to just leave it.

Only fixing something for myself I have my own sense of perfection in the look I'm going for which is way different than what you and max and all do. Nevertheless I do appreciate all the sharing

I have never used a 1/16 rod maybe it's worse than I imagine-no wait I have an old original one right here that slips on the pin yet operates most excellently in its thin ivory scales, just as it always has I'm sure.

Originally Posted by BingoBango

I get your sarcasm Glen, but then Max posts this...? (Maybe I just didn't get his sarcasm.)

Where's the sarcasm in my answer to you?

Here I am just answering and trying to give you my advise, same as Glen. I look at the picture and read your question and see a crooked pivot hole with some remaining steel. Plain and simple. I've been through many of those exact same ones.
Trying to stick a tubing (aka sleeve) will not work with the remaining steel in the pivot hole unless you completely drill or tap out that hole making it easy to add a tubing (aka sleeve).
I don't or never used epoxy to fill that hole either. This is all just my advise so take it for what it's worth.

I have found that the epoxy method works well and is very easy to do. Just when drilling your new 1/16 hole make sure you center it well