Thread: The world I would love to live in.

I don't think you should be insulting even if you strongly disagree with people's beliefs. You can say it in a nice, cordial way and also if you see something wrong; it's better not to leave, but to stay and try to improve the situation. Nothing will get better unless we put in the work to change ideas and how the world is. Also, I think if you read the entire thread many different viewpoints and paths are brought up. It is all over the place and that's the great thing: the exchange of ideas and opinions. I hope you stick around cause you gonna miss many wonderful people and things offered at SRP.

I'll probably get flamed, but what really is the point of a thread like this?

Right Gentlemen, I have removed 4 posts from this thread.
SRP is not the place for name calling and dis-respectful behaviour towards each other.
Please, stay on topic and most of all, be respectful of others opinions.

Birnando, the mod team

Originally Posted by aa1192

I don't think you should be insulting even if you strongly disagree with people's beliefs. You can say it in a nice, cordial way and also if you see something wrong; it's better not to leave, but to stay and try to improve the situation. Nothing will get better unless we put in the work to change ideas and how the world is. Also, I think if you read the entire thread many different viewpoints and paths are brought up. It is all over the place and that's the great thing: the exchange of ideas and opinions. I hope you stick around cause you gonna miss many wonderful people and things offered at SRP.

It's a great thing only if you can actually read the entire thread and all postings. We should concentrate less on "tolerating" one another and more on respecting one another and loving one another. Even if we disagree.

But again, those who preach tolerance are the least tolerant of different opinions.

Frank

Originally Posted by Lakebound

But again, those who preach tolerance are the least tolerant of different opinions.

Frank

Well, but disagreement != intolerance.

Without attributing motive in this case, one hears the quoted sentiment pretty regularly as a way to silence critique. Person A expresses an opinion, Person B describes it as intolerant or bigoted, and Person A says, "You're not tolerating my opinion! See, you're intolerant!"

If someone were to make race-related or religion-related comments analogous to those expressed here concerning sexuality (wishing that some ethnic/religious population didn't exist, or treating them as a problem to be solved, or questioning their morality as a class), it would not be treated as an opinion worthy of reasoned discussion. Members would recoil, and the post likely deleted. We agree as a community that (say) white supremacy is simply not a topic on which reasonable people disagree...at least not here.

In some communities, posts in such a vein about gays are treated the same way. SRP is not such a community; okay. But for some members to describe that they perceive such posts as intolerant or bigoted is not "intolerance". All they deny their conversation partner is the privilege to express their views without criticism.

My 2¢, to take or to leave.

Originally Posted by deepweeds

Well, but disagreement != intolerance.

Without attributing motive in this case, one hears the quoted sentiment pretty regularly as a way to silence critique. Person A expresses an opinion, Person B describes it as intolerant or bigoted, and Person A says, "You're not tolerating my opinion! See, you're intolerant!"

If someone were to make race-related or religion-related comments analogous to those expressed here concerning sexuality (wishing that some ethnic/religious population didn't exist, or treating them as a problem to be solved, or questioning their morality as a class), it would not be treated as an opinion worthy of reasoned discussion. Members would recoil, and the post likely deleted. We agree as a community that (say) white supremacy is simply not a topic on which reasonable people disagree...at least not here.

In some communities, posts in such a vein about gays are treated the same way. SRP is not such a community; okay. But for some members to describe that they perceive such posts as intolerant or bigoted is not "intolerance". All they deny their conversation partner is the privilege to express their views without criticism.

My 2¢, to take or to leave.

So, only the politically correct held beliefs may be espoused in the world. All others must be suppressed. And I am not speaking about this forum but rather modern society as a whole.

Proof in the US would be the targeting of certain groups by the IRS.

Those in power will suppress opposing opinions one way or another. Either directly or indirectly by means of propaganda.

My 2 cents.

Frank

Originally Posted by ScoutHikerDad

I'll probably get flamed, but what really is the point of a thread like this?

You for sure don't want to get flamed by Trogdor "The Burninator". Thankfully, you are not a peasant, living in a thatch roof cottage.....in the night.

The Constitution does not stand alone as far as documents go. Yes it is the framework of our government which we the people have lost all control over. You are living an allusion if you think for one minute you are voting for the candidate of your choice. These people they put in front of you to vote on are pre selected, bought and paid for, and no one else is allowed to play the game. The agencies like the FDA, IRS, Homeland security, even those in the judicial system are hand picked for their political alliances. The reality of today is far from what the founding fathers had in mind and that is why we are here discussing futile points of interest. That is why we are concerned about being over run with illegals, giving to much to those who don't deserve it, not giving enough to those who do. We have lost track of what is really important because we are led to believe all this other stuff is the problem. When it becomes to much to live with then those with guns and a leader will change it all. That is why we are to keep and bear arms. Although I think this is probably a mute point anymore because anyone who was smart enough to lead the change would be jailed and or killed before they got started. And as trusting as everyone is in this country they wouldn't believe him if he did come along. Money runs this country and it's not the money that is in plain view. This is exactly the opposite of what the founders had in mind regardless of time frames and their ancient ways of viewing the world. We are still fighting the same fight they started only we are not as smart and or as brave as they were.

Originally Posted by gugi

Or more likely they thought that these small details are so important that should be left up to the 'government of the people' to set up and more importantly change as they want.

I don't think they were so arrogant as to think that their 18th century ideas would be appropriate or wanted by the people living in the 19th, 20th, 21st, and so on centuries. Apparently they got even some of the 'big picture' wrong (third paragraph of section 2 in article 1 cited above).

Therefore you think it appropriate to reject ideas merely because of age, and regardless of merit. "Thou shalt not steal" predates the 18th century by a few years, at least. Are the principles of the Ten Commandments unwanted and inappropriate because they have descended from a long ago age? You may disagree with them, but I'm not buying the logical fallacy that just because an idea is old, it must be obsolete.

Why not list the 18th century ideas you disagree with and argue based on merit, or lack thereof.

I am taking bets on who will have the last word .. ... a very important thing to some ........ I guess it is the Vince Lombardi philosophy ........ i.e. 'winning is everything' .......... PM for details .......